Chicago Cubs

[DMBZeppelin]

Well my guess is Ramirez will homer to make it 11-10 Phils and then will load the bases with no outs, and hit into a triple play.

[DMBZeppelin]

The only thing scarier then that loss was that lady's stare with the cup holder on her head.

[UCFish]

Most demoralizing loss of the year???

I mean we battle back to just completely self destruct.

[davehead86]

Are you fucking kidding me

"Antonio Alfonseca notched the win for the Phillies, pitching two-thirds of the seventh."

This is the bum fuck that killed us for YEARS, and now we cant hit against him.
Why do our closers fucking suck.

[DMBZeppelin]

Are you fucking kidding me

"Antonio Alfonseca notched the win for the Phillies, pitching two-thirds of the seventh."

This is the bum fuck that killed us for YEARS, and now we cant hit against him.
Why do our closers fucking suck.
Maybe he finally figured out how to use that sixth finger to form a new grip.

[davehead86]

Maybe he finally figured out how to use that sixth finger to form a new grip.

:BANG :BANG :BANG

[DMBCubs25]

face it, we suck, i dont know whats more pathetic, the fact that we literally were sleepwalking dead for the first half of the game, or that we showed some life to take the lead and the fuckin bullpen blows it with 2 oust and nobody on, id expect that from a junior high school team, not a major league team, that gets paid millions, demote ohman to single a, give howry some more bbq grills to lift so he fucks up his back, and just release jones for the piece of shit worthless baseball player that he is, 2006 was awful but think about it, were already 8 games out first place on mothers day, fuck this team

[Bron Yr Aur]

face it, we suck, i dont know whats more pathetic, the fact that we literally were sleepwalking dead for the first half of the game, or that we showed some life to take the lead and the fuckin bullpen blows it with 2 oust and nobody on, id expect that from a junior high school team, not a major league team, that gets paid millions, demote ohman to single a, give howry some more bbq grills to lift so he fucks up his back, and just release jones for the piece of shit worthless baseball player that he is, 2006 was awful but think about it, were already 8 games out first place on mothers day, fuck this team

Weak sauce. Again, I don't know you, but from your comments, you really are a horrible fan. Listen, we're all upset, but everytime we lose a game you act like you're giving up hope. Yeah, Jacque is so worthless, he's been better than Murton or Floyd, IMO...

[HolyCow]

Disappointing loss today. Good thing there's still 128 more games to go.

[DMBZeppelin]

Weak sauce. Again, I don't know you, but from your comments, you really are a horrible fan. Listen, we're all upset, but everytime we lose a game you act like you're giving up hope. Yeah, Jacque is so worthless, he's been better than Murton or Floyd, IMO...
Jones is hitting .265 and seems to ground into a fair share of double plays. Floyd is hitting .264 and Murton is hitting .279 off the bench. Those two would hit a lot better if they ever had a chance to get into a rhythm. Batting average wise the only people with better batting averages then Murton, that have at least 50 AB's is Lee, Soriano, and Theriot.

[UCFish]

Anyone know what happened to Lee??

[DMBCubs25]

sore neck, something of that degree, not very serious

[DMBCubs25]

Weak sauce. Again, I don't know you, but from your comments, you really are a horrible fan. Listen, we're all upset, but everytime we lose a game you act like you're giving up hope. Yeah, Jacque is so worthless, he's been better than Murton or Floyd, IMO...

its been 98 years since they won a world series, shit like yesterdays game really shouldnt be tolerated by the fans anymore

[UCFish]

Cubs win.

Great game by Ted Lily.

[DMBCubs25]

Cubs win.

Great game by Ted Lily.

:thumbsup :thumbsup

[gocubsgo3822]

cubs win!!!!!!!!!!

[HolyCow]

Great ball game today. Nice to see some cushion added on in the top of the ninth for once.

And Ryan Dempster is an All-Star. There. I said it.

[JaJunk]

Great ball game today. Nice to see some cushion added on in the top of the ninth for once.

And Ryan Dempster is an All-Star. There. I said it.

he sure is pitching like one

[DMBCubs25]

Great ball game today. Nice to see some cushion added on in the top of the ninth for once.

And Ryan Dempster is an All-Star. There. I said it.

with the exception of the pujols home run, and the pirates game he really has pitched well this year, hes been one of the few bright spots in a pretty dissapointing bullpen, hopefully he keeps it up

[GinaNMU]

W


Lilly's definitely been stepping up so far. Very impressed by him!

[penn darvis]

Great ball game today. Nice to see some cushion added on in the top of the ninth for once.

And Ryan Dempster is an All-Star. There. I said it.
Just because he's the best guy in the bullpen doesn't make him an all-star.

[HolyCow]

Just because he's the best guy in the bullpen doesn't make him an all-star.
Give me a better closer in the National League.

Demp is 8/9 and holding batters under .140.

He is an All-Star caliber closer.

[HolyCow]

W


Lilly's definitely been stepping up so far. Very impressed by him!
Seriously. If you would have told Cub fans three years ago we would have 3 of the best pitchers (at the current time) in the NL, they would have said sure... Prior, Wood and Zambrano.

But it turns out it is Lilly, Marquis and Hill. How times change.

[DMBCubs25]

boy if only we had a healthy kerry wood in the setup role instead of bob howry/scott eyre, how much better we would be

[bothedmbfan]

Ted Lilly....who saw that fucking coming?

[UCFish]

And his two losses were 2-1 and 1-0. He should be 5-0.

[bothedmbfan]

We should get a solid #5 before the trade deadline.

[Ev42]

i think Guzman will be are #5

[davehead86]

boy if only we had a healthy kerry wood in the setup role instead of bob howry/scott eyre, how much better we would be

Thats what I was excited about. Wood might not be a full game pitcher anymore, but he sure as hell would make a fucking amazing closer.

Ted Lilly....who saw that fucking coming?

The first game he pitched I said wow, Lilly (and Hill the next game) are def gonna do very well in this season. Im glad I was right about that, they are doign awsome and looks like they arent being worked too terribly much.

[Tiduwho]

Give me a better closer in the National League.

Demp is 8/9 and holding batters under .140.

He is an All-Star caliber closer.

Cordero, Hoffman, Billy Wagner, Saito.... :shrug

[Tiduwho]

How the hell did that ball get out? And come on Murton!!! Catch that effing ball! Jaque Jones would have caught that. I dont' like Murton in right.

[bothedmbfan]

I don't like Murton period.

[gocubsgo3822]

marquis is a marquee signing

[bothedmbfan]

GOD DAMN IT!

Bases loaded, and we get zilch.

[SatelliteEyes]

marquis is a marquee signing

do you write the headlines for a newspaper? you should.

[bothedmbfan]

do you write the headlines for a newspaper? you should.

I sense a hint of sarcasm there.

[gocubsgo3822]

i do not wite te ehadlines but i should. i am very good at predicting the healdine for the tribune sports section the next day. like really good. I am pretty good. I am being modest too i believe. Some people are just good at headline writing...

lets get some runs

[penn darvis]

Wow, this sucks.

Go Cubs bullpen.

[bothedmbfan]

Wow, this sucks.

Go Cubs bullpen.

That's about as pointless as trying to argue that Stryper is the best metal band of all time.

[Tiduwho]

I fall asleep and not only miss most of 24, I get to see the Cubs blew the lead.

[penn darvis]

That's about as pointless as trying to argue that Stryper is the best metal band of all time.
Oops forgot the sarcasm tag.

That's pretty funny though.

[JaJunk]

cubs bullpen :lol :lol :lol :lorraine

[Tiduwho]

I would rather lose on a GRAND SLAM. THROW THE FUCKING BALL DOWN THE MIDDLE YOU PIECE OF SHIT. FUCK THIS BULLPEN. GOD DAMNIT!!!!



NEVER WALK. NEVER. NEVER. Give him a grand fucking slam. Do NOT walk. You worthless POS bullpen. :BANG

Worst loss of the season. This is worse than the Phillies game.

[Bron Yr Aur]

Ouch, that fucking hurt.

[GinaNMU]

:BANG :BANG :BANG

This is how I feel at least once a week with this damn team.


It's a good thing that true love never dies, man. Unconditional. :lol

[crashintonickdm]

rolflmao @ the cubbies.

[DMBCubs25]

we suck, unless the pitcher throws 8 innings of 1-2 run ball and the offense scores 7 runs, we are bound to lose the game, mark my words this bullpen cannot be trusted with a lead the rest of the season, this is why we will be failing to qualify for the postseason again

[Ev42]

bullpen=:eek :mad :mad :BANG :BANG :violent :lorraine :lorraine

[UCFish]

I would rather have seen a walk off grand slam than walking in the winning run. Just awful.

[penn darvis]

I get to see 2 games this week and they are both devastating losses. Maybe I should just go back to the gametracker.

[UCFish]

"I had a great at-bat there," DeRosa said. "He made a 3-2 pitch, threw a changeup, I hit it good and popped it up.

HAHAHAHAHA that is DeRosa talking about his bases loaded at-bat with a two run lead. Yes he made it through a few pitches but for god sake do not say that is was a GREAT at bat. Fuck we are 0-15 in the month of May with the bases loaded. That is awful. I still think we can turn this around but shit it is frustrating.

[UCFish]

Well that was sure a clutch Grand Slam by Ramirez. Still afraid we could blow it though.

[Ev42]

that was a monster homerun

[JaJunk]

tack on runs :hump and we scored with the bases loaded :hump

[Ev42]

good game so far

[UCFish]

Cubs Win!!!

[DMBCubs25]

good effort tonight, and my congratulations to michael barret for hitting the first sac fly of the year

[Bron Yr Aur]

That was a joyous occasion, seeing Aramis rock that ball tonight. I think I exclaimed "Fuck Yeah!" as soon as the ball left the bat. That's what we need, right there. Strong hitting, and a good outing by Zambrano.

[DMBZeppelin]

If Zambrano is back then this rotation will really take off. Everyone has been great, but Big Z. Getting our ace back is huge. Lets just hope D-Lee is ok. It was suggested on Cubs.com that Soriano might move to the two hole when D-Lee returns. Which I'd like because if Theriot leads off. That will be awesome for when Soriano hits homers and doubles. Seems like a waste to have all that power leading off.

[gocubsgo3822]

cubs win!!!!! we need to win tom.

[Bron Yr Aur]

If Zambrano is back then this rotation will really take off. Everyone has been great, but Big Z. Getting our ace back is huge. Lets just hope D-Lee is ok. It was suggested on Cubs.com that Soriano might move to the two hole when D-Lee returns. Which I'd like because if Theriot leads off. That will be awesome for when Soriano hits homers and doubles. Seems like a waste to have all that power leading off.

I agree, especially if Theriot keeps hitting like he does. He's deceptively fast, and he can really hit the ball.

[GinaNMU]

Zambrano definitely needed that W last night. BIG win for big Z.
Let's hope this turns things around for him.

[daveS]

Great to see Zambrano get the win. I think Theriot should lead off and Soriano bat second. I think Theriot is alot more patient at the plate and can draw alot of walks.

[davehead86]

Great to see Zambrano get the win. I think Theriot should lead off and Soriano bat second. I think Theriot is alot more patient at the plate and can draw alot of walks.

Very very true. But eventually (at least what everyone says) is that Soriano will get better and act like Theriot is right now. We'll just see if that happens.

[DMBZeppelin]

Great to see Zambrano get the win. I think Theriot should lead off and Soriano bat second. I think Theriot is alot more patient at the plate and can draw alot of walks.
Actually they had a article on Cubs.com how when D-Lee comes back that they'll likely be doing that. Which makes sense since Soriano hits a lot of homers and doubles with no one on base. Plus whenever they decide to bring Pie back up he'll be an awesome lead off hitter.

[UCFish]

So what are the odds that our bullpen can hold this game up for us and get Guzman his first victory.

[Ev42]

4 run lead i say they can do it. at least i hope they can.

[UCFish]

Fuck Ohman actually looks good for once.

[Ev42]

1 more inning to go. wonder if they bring demp in

[UCFish]

This is ugly.

[JaJunk]

1 more inning to go. wonder if they bring demp in

why can't we buy a consistent closer?

[UCFish]

Unbelievable.

[JaJunk]

i give up. fuck the cubs. i'm done

[Ev42]

well that sucked 4 run lead in 9th and don't win

[dmbman32]

The Cubs are turning into a metaphor of life:

Just when you think everything's going great, they turn around and kick you in the nuts.

[dmbman32]

well that sucked 4 run lead in 9th and don't win

You couldn't write something like that. How does that happen?

[JaJunk]

You couldn't write something like that. How does that happen?

life in chicago. happens all the time. we are cursed, but cursed with shitty players.

[Ev42]

You couldn't write something like that. How does that happen?

it's the fucking cubs thats how:(

[dmbman32]

life in chicago. happens all the time. we are cursed, but cursed with shitty players.

I was born and raised in Chicago. I grew up, and still am a die-hard Cubs fan. I'm interning with the Red Sox this summer.

I'm sitting at Fenway watching the Gameday on my computer, and seeing them choke yet again. My heart's still breaking because of these guys. Even with a Red Sox win today, this still fucking sucks.

[TapNorris]

Fuckin' Dempster!!!! I've never had any confidence in him!!!

[JaJunk]

Fuckin' Dempster!!!! I've never had any confidence in him!!!

he just doesn't have great stuff. bottom line.

[JaJunk]

I was born and raised in Chicago. I grew up, and still am a die-hard Cubs fan. I'm interning with the Red Sox this summer.

I'm sitting at Fenway watching the Gameday on my computer, and seeing them choke yet again. My heart's still breaking because of these guys. Even with a Red Sox win today, this still fucking sucks.

i try not to let them get to me anymore, but they piss me off. we need to manufacture runs and build a solid bullpen with a great closer. it's that simple.

[Ev42]

we are dead in the water unless we change up this bullpen somehow.

[Bron Yr Aur]

How the FUCK do they blow that four-run lead in the ninth...I missed this, how the fuck could they not stop the bleeding???

[JaJunk]

How the FUCK do they blow that four-run lead in the ninth...I missed this, how the fuck could they not stop the bleeding???

just how we haven't been able to all year. you know how.

[Bron Yr Aur]

Why did Lou bring in Eyre of all fucking people to try to save the game??

[SmoothD41]

wow, that is a monumental collapse. and Reyes and Beltran weren't even involved. The Cubs bullpen is laughable, at absolute best.

[Ev42]

who else they all blow donkey nuts

[JaJunk]

Why did Lou bring in Eyre of all fucking people to try to save the game??

dempster started the inning. he brought eyre in to face green but wright pinch hit for him.

[Ev42]

you think the loss would not get worse than that philly, and bam :mad :mad :BANG :BANG :lorraine :lorraine :violent

man this weekend is going to be unbearable i think

[JaJunk]

at least i don't have to deal with sox fans while i'm down here. sox fans are nonexistent outside of chicago.

[Ev42]

at least i don't have to deal with sox fans while i'm down here. sox fans are nonexistent outside of chicago.

you are lucky i am going to be watching the game with a house full of sox fans. It won't be fun:(

[DMBZeppelin]

I can't even explain how pissed off I am. This is how I felt at the end of last year. I really don't want to see Eyre, Howry, or Dempster ever again. This is probably a result of the Baker Voodoo when he was in the booth for ESPN the other night. We should call up Marmol and Marshall and try them in the pen. I mean it can't hurt because either we continue losing, or things start turning around. Not to mention we're wasting valueable games as the Brewers start to crash.

[HolyCow]

I don't even want to talk about the Cubs anymore.

[DMBCubs25]

fuck this team, 6 reasons why we wont win this year, and there all from the bullpen believe it or not, imo howry eyre and dempster deserve to have a severe decrease in salary, they should be lit up by the fans tomorrow at home because of how bad they are, and overall i couldnt be more pissed that we turned what should have been a 5-2 road trip into a 2-5 one, im speechless

[Ev42]

fuck this team, 6 reasons why we wont win this year, and there all from the bullpen believe it or not, imo howry eyre and dempster deserve to have a severe decrease in salary, they should be lit up by the fans tomorrow at home because of how bad they are, and overall i couldnt be more pissed that we turned what should have been a 5-2 road trip into a 2-5 one, im speechless

well said

[TapNorris]

Did everyone give up on them after yesterday? Am I the only one watching them right now?

[Ev42]

i just got home watching it

[TapNorris]

I did not expect to see this after yesterday's meltdown. I thought all confidence would be shot.....the Sox must just suck THAT much this year!

[Ev42]

hope they can bring at least 1 run home

[TapNorris]

That was a strange play...I'll take it though. They can easily get another.

[TapNorris]

I'm going to give Dempster the benefit of the doubt today....three runs should be more than enough!

[Ev42]

it better be

[dmbman32]

Thank Fucking Christ.

Cubs Win!!! I forgot they were allowed to do that.

[Ev42]

good to see the bullpen not give up runs

[UCFish]

Thank God. All I can say after yesterday.

[Bron Yr Aur]

I think you're all forgetting that once we sweep the Sox we'll have a .500 record.

[JaJunk]

I think you're all forgetting that once we sweep the Sox we'll have a .500 record.

we should be 10 games over.

[Ev42]

we should be 10 games over.

very true. hope we can get everything going now:thumbsup

[DMBZeppelin]

We should call up Marmol and Marshall and try them in the pen.
Lou must have an Ants account. The day after I suggest it Marmol gets called up. Either way check this out from his pre-game today. Big changes are coming. Hopefully one of the surprises is Jones being traded. With Pagan being super hot we once again have too many outfielders. Even though Pie is tearing up Triple-A now that he's back playing everyday.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

CHICAGO -- Cubs manager Lou Piniella has some surprises in store.

Piniella wouldn't reveal any secrets, but apparently there are changes ahead for the pitching staff, which actually began Friday when right-hander Carlos Marmol was recalled from Triple-A Iowa. The Cubs have an off-day Monday before starting a West Coast trip, and Piniella was asked if the rotation was going to change.

"We're going to make some changes here with our alignment," Piniella said. "We'll have some interesting things for you on Monday or Tuesday."

[cbotnyse]

I hate the Cubs. fuckers. We handed that game to you today.

[DMBZeppelin]

I hate the Cubs. fuckers. We handed that game to you today.
Well that was very generous of you.

[cbotnyse]

Well that was very generous of you.:mad:mad:mad

[Ev42]

:mad:mad:mad

i don't mind brewer fans coming in this thread but white sox fans f that

[cbotnyse]

i don't mind brewer fans coming in this thread but white sox fans f thatTrust me I never venture into this hell hole of a thread. :) Only 2 weekends a year.

[DMBZeppelin]

Hey in case you're not in the immediate area of Chicago. Go to www.670thescore.com and on the right hand side is recent audio. Check out Ozzie takes on Mike North. In the audio below it is the A.J. Interview. I guess A.J. complained about not starting today against the Cubs. Ozzie heard it and got pissed. So he called up, and just started cussing up a storm. My Favorite part of all this is this is what he tells his boss Kenny Williams:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Williams didn't seemed overly concerned about his talkative manager's latest controversy.

"Am I OK with it? No, I don't like the use of the language. But in talking with Ozzie, he was surprised when I informed him he used a few choice words that are really not acceptable for the radio," Williams said.

"He was shocked that he actually used a couple of them to the extent that he did. So that was pure and raw anger that was coming out."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ya I guess Ozzie has mental issues if he can't even remember what he's saying. I think eventually he's going to say something bad enough to cost him his job.

[Ev42]

Trust me I never venture into this hell hole of a thread. :) Only 2 weekends a year.

i have to go to the cell i thing next weekend not looking forward to that.

[JaJunk]

i have to go to the cell i thing next weekend not looking forward to that.

world's largest ghetto

[Ev42]

world's largest ghetto

:thumbsup so true :thumbsup

[cbotnyse]

world's largest ghetto:lol :rolleyes at least they play real baseball there.

[JaJunk]

:lol :rolleyes at least they play real baseball there.

i don't like to bash on the sux as a team, but i can't call it playing "real" baseball if the pitcher doesn't hit.

[Ev42]

:lol :rolleyes at least they play real baseball there.


you have to admit the south side of chicago sucks donkey nuts.

[cbotnyse]

i don't like to bash on the sux as a team, but i can't call it playing "real" baseball if the pitcher doesn't hit.what does the pitcher hitting have anything to do with anything?

[JaJunk]

what does the pitcher hitting have anything to do with anything?

real baseball is played without the dh.

[JaJunk]

you have to admit the south side of chicago sucks donkey nuts.

not if your a bail bondsman.

[cbotnyse]

you have to admit the south side of chicago sucks donkey nuts.I do not admit that at all. I grew up there and the south side is full of hard working, good people. It is a fine side of the city. The south side is full of life long Chicagoans. The north side is a melting pot of people from all over the country. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the north side, but the south side does not suck by any means.

[Ev42]

what part of the south side. i lived in Hyde park and it was a shit hole

[Ev42]

not if your a bail bondsman.

you know it is true

[cbotnyse]

what part of the south side. i lived in Hyde park and it was a shit holeI grew up on the far southwest side. (Beverly, Mount Greenwood, Wrightwood areas) Hyde Park is not bad, it is home to one of the best schools in the country. Trust me, the south side is not all ghetto.

[Ev42]

yes hyde park is bad, but it does have one of the best colleges around

[UCFish]

South side sucks. Go Cubs.

[dmbinchicago]

Hey in case you're not in the immediate area of Chicago. Go to www.670thescore.com and on the right hand side is recent audio. Check out Ozzie takes on Mike North. In the audio below it is the A.J. Interview. I guess A.J. complained about not starting today against the Cubs. Ozzie heard it and got pissed. So he called up, and just started cussing up a storm. My Favorite part of all this is this is what he tells his boss Kenny Williams:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Williams didn't seemed overly concerned about his talkative manager's latest controversy.

"Am I OK with it? No, I don't like the use of the language. But in talking with Ozzie, he was surprised when I informed him he used a few choice words that are really not acceptable for the radio," Williams said.

"He was shocked that he actually used a couple of them to the extent that he did. So that was pure and raw anger that was coming out."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ya I guess Ozzie has mental issues if he can't even remember what he's saying. I think eventually he's going to say something bad enough to cost him his job.
I actually got that link sent to me by a big Sox fan, who said that maybe it's time for Ozzie to go. They'll never fire him though. Reinsdorf loves him.

[DMBCubs25]

White sox suck, the south side of chicago is complete shit a garbage can and an awful place to be near, ozzie guillen is a joke, go cubs, i cant wait to see another sellout at our stadium instead of watchin that dump us cellular home to an average of 10,000 fans per game, what a pathetic excuse of a franchise

[DMBCubs25]

I actually got that link sent to me by a big Sox fan, who said that maybe it's time for Ozzie to go. They'll never fire him though. Reinsdorf loves him.

its inevitable that once guillen is fired by the sox, he will never be hired as a manager again, the guy is an absolute headcase and psycho, nobody in baseball likes the guy

[SatelliteEyes]

I was at the White Sox/Yankees game on Thursday. I was impressed with the Stadium, the fans and the Southside.

I was even more impressed when the place erupted into cheers and laughter when they put up the Cubs score in the bottom of the 9th after blowing that lead to the Mets.

[DMBCubs25]

I was at the White Sox/Yankees game on Thursday. I was impressed with the Stadium, the fans and the Southside.

I was even more impressed when the place erupted into cheers and laughter when they put up the Cubs score in the bottom of the 9th after blowing that lead to the Mets.

thats because they care more in-depth about what the cubs do than what the sox do, i wouldnt be suprised if some of those "fans" were only watching what the cubs were doing instead of watching there own team, there not really sox fans, there more of cub haters

[bothedmbfan]

its inevitable that once guillen is fired by the sox, he will never be hired as a manager again, the guy is an absolute headcase and psycho, nobody in baseball likes the guy

Oh if he gets fired, he'll be hired again.

[Bron Yr Aur]

It used to be that people in Chicago could cheer for both teams, but now that the Sox got all of the bandwagon fans from 2005, it's like some sort of competition to them... :rolleyes

Whatever, I don't care, the Cubs will always be THE Chicago baseball team anyway.

[Ev42]

It used to be that people in Chicago could cheer for both teams, but now that the Sox got all of the bandwagon fans from 2005, it's like some sort of competition to them... :rolleyes

Whatever, I don't care, the Cubs will always be THE Chicago baseball team anyway.

:thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup

[Tiduwho]

So Ozzie Guillen says that there's no way he's showering at Wrigley. There's too many rats. And it's the worst place to play in the league.

[TapNorris]

I was at the White Sox/Yankees game on Thursday. I was impressed with the Stadium, the fans and the Southside.


That's because you're a Brewers fan.

[TapNorris]

2-0 over the sux in the 2nd. Anyone else watching?

[Ev42]

watching in a house full of sox fan:violent

[UCFish]

Good Start

[TapNorris]

watching in a house full of sox fan:violent

That can't be fun.

[TapNorris]

Damnitall!

[Ev42]

yeah. i am about ready to leave my house and go to the movies.

[TapNorris]

All right MB!!!

[TapNorris]

That makes up for some shitty pitching in the 4th.

[tedies]

god Vazquiz stats are just horrible after the fourth :lol its showing

[UCFish]

Wow way to help yourself from the plate.

[TapNorris]

He needs to help himself on the mound!

[JaJunk]

dlee :hump

[Bron Yr Aur]

Derek Lee comes through in the clutch, hell yeah! Damn that was huge, considering he hadn't even played for almost a week....great end to a great game, time for the sweep tomorrow. Zambrano should be pitching, I think...

[UCFish]

Great Game.

Cubs Win.

[Jackson Young]

i love baseball

<a href="http://www.freewebs.com/jyowns/">Visit My Website</a>

[cbotnyse]

Whatever, I don't care, the Cubs will always be THE Chicago baseball team anyway.I'll take a World Series over being THE Chicago baseball team, whatever that means.

I tip my hat the the Cubs today, our bullpen blows another one. :mad

[Tiduwho]

i love baseball

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How are you not banned yet you tool?




Cubs Win! Let's sweep them back to the Southside tomorrow!

[UCFish]

I'll take a World Series over being THE Chicago baseball team, whatever that means.

I tip my hat the the Cubs today, our bullpen blows another one. :mad

We know how you feel. Our bullpen has blown a shitload and we tried to do it again today.

[DMBZeppelin]

I'll take a World Series over being THE Chicago baseball team, whatever that means.

I tip my hat the the Cubs today, our bullpen blows another one. :mad
D-Lee's pinch hit grand slam is going down in Cubs lore, and it means that no one really cares about the White Sox. Ya it's cool you guys had 05'. But I went with a buddy to a Sox game in September of 05'. I took pictures of all the empty seats.

Sure after you won it I saw so many of the World Series hats everywhere. Fact is though Cubs are the baseball team of Chicago. Hell Ozzie even said you guys would have to win like 5 (he might have said more) World Series in a row to change that.

Maybe you don't want to admit it, but you know what it means. You know that it's true. Shouldn't change the way you feel about your team though.

[cbotnyse]

D-Lee's pinch hit grand slam is going down in Cubs lore, and it means that no one really cares about the White Sox. Cubs lore? Its one game in May. Wouldn't beating teams in your division be a little more important? We were down to our last out last year at Wrigley and AJ hit a HR to win it. Have you forgotten that already? *shrug* no big deal.
Maybe you don't want to admit it, but you know what it means.No I have no idea what it means. I could care less who is more popular. We won a World Series, you guys haven't in 100 years. That is all that matters. Maybe you don't want to admit it. If you want to win a popularity contest go ahead. I'll take a World Series.

[UCFish]

Only 99 Years.

[cbotnyse]

Only 99 Years.I sit corrected. :)

[dmbinchicago]

What a day at Wrigley. One of the best games I have seen in person. :)

[JaJunk]

my disdain for the sox and their fans grows with every passing day. good win for chicago :D

[Ev42]

great game to watch with a house full of white sox fans

[DMBCubs25]

lets bring out the brooms tomorrow and shove them in ozzies fuckin face when big Z completes the sweep, chicagos better team won today

[Ev42]

How are you not banned yet you tool?




Cubs Win! Let's sweep them back to the Southside tomorrow!

:thumbsup :thumbsup awesome Avatar:thumbsup :thumbsup

[UCFish]

Lets finish it off today and get back to .500.

[cbotnyse]

Lets finish it off today and get back to .500.The fight for .500 today! :rolleyes I just want to avoid the sweep and get this damn series over with. I am much more concerned about playing in the toughest division in baseball.

UCFish, you seem to be the most level headed Cub fan here who is not concerned with attendance, but with actually winning. Good luck today sir. :thumbsup

[UCFish]

The fight for .500 today! :rolleyes I just want to avoid the sweep and get this damn series over with. I am much more concerned about playing in the toughest division in baseball.

UCFish, you seem to be the most level headed Cub fan here who is not concerned with attendance, but with actually winning. Good luck today sir. :thumbsup

Thanks buddy. Same to you. Although we need to win. :monkey

[cbotnyse]

Grand Slam AJ! This will go down in Sox lore! :lol

[UCFish]

Oh well 2 out 3 aint bad. Just wish it would have been anyone but that little bitch. Maybe Barret should have punched him as he crossed home plate :evil

[GinaNMU]

Ugh. I fucking HATE that little bitch.

[cbotnyse]

sweet. :evil

[DMBCubs25]

sweet. :evil

the sox won the series, o wait....

[DMBCubs25]

at this point im willing to let zambrano walk rather than pay him the ridicoulous amount of money he bitches about not getting, let another national league team make the mistake of signing him to an insane amount. Let the triple aaa kids like marmol and guzman take over the bullpen, cotts howry eyre wuertz and ohman all suck. Jones nice throw probably the worst one ive seen in my life, im confident i would have made a more accurate throw

[cbotnyse]

the sox won the series, o wait....I know, we blew it. But this game softens the blow.

[UCFish]

A game like this where we get blown out does not bother me near as much as one where we blow a ninth run lead or walk in a run to lose/tie it up, or have a 4 run lead in the seventh which slowly trickles away. Worst of all having men in scoring position in extra inning games with no outs and not getting them across the plate. We straight up got an ass beating today and that I am ok with even though it was close til the grand slam and the tack on runs. I don't mind losing but I hate the crushing defeats in games that we should win.

[DMBCubs25]

I know, we blew it. But this game softens the blow.

ya, we somehow won the battle of the bullpens in this series, which is rather incredible seeing how pathetic our blowpen is, you guys can have neal cotts back if you want

[UCFish]

Oh yeah and Zambrano needs to just shut his mouth and regain his All Star form. No more Cy Young just work on lowering you ERA below 5.

[DMBCubs25]

A game like this where we get blown out does not bother me near as much as one where we blow a ninth run lead or walk in a run to lose/tie it up, or have a 4 run lead in the seventh which slowly trickles away. Worst of all having me in scoring position in extra inning games with no outs and not getting them across the plate. We straight up got an ass beating today and that I am ok with even though it was close til the grand slam and the tack on runs. I don't mind losing but I hate the crushing defeats in games that we should win.

i agree, its nice to lose normally for a change, even though i still cant figure out how we gave up 7 runs with 2 outs and no one on cuz zambranos a psychopath headcase on the mound. This game and wednesday against the mets are the only 2 games this year where weve really gotten the shit beat out of us, which is pretty encouragaing

[cbotnyse]

ya, we somehow won the battle of the bullpens in this series, which is rather incredible seeing how pathetic our blowpen is, you guys can have neal cotts back if you want:lol yeah it took Neal Cotts to wake up our offense.

[UCFish]

i agree, its nice to lose normally for a change, even though i still cant figure out how we gave up 7 runs with 2 outs and no one on cuz zambranos a psychopath headcase on the mound. This game and wednesday against the mets are the only 2 games this year where weve really gotten the shit beat out of us, which is pretty encouragaing

Which drives me crazy because we absolutely blow in one run and extra innings games.

[Ev42]

oh well leave it up to the shit bullpen.

[cbotnyse]

rut roh

[UCFish]

So I don't really follow the Sox but does you bullpen blow ass too? I mean what is wrong with these two bullpens.

[cbotnyse]

So I don't really follow the Sox but does you bullpen blow ass too? I mean what is wrong with these two bullpens.I have no idea whats going on. We were fine until this series. Our bats have sucked, and now they are ok, and our pitching sucks. Moral of the story, .500 team. :mad

[DMBCubs25]

anyone happen to see jones throw on that one single by i think it was macowiak, the throw home was about 50 feet offline and nowhere near home, he has to have probably the worst accurate arm in the majors, he makes murton look like vlad guerrero

[UCFish]

NO I missed it. I am at work watching on MLB.TV and I have to hide it most of the time. It does not surprise me though. I miss Pie and his cannon.

[DMBZeppelin]

Grand Slam AJ! This will go down in Sox lore! :lol
Hey why don't you go spend some time in the White Sox thread... oh wait.

[GinaNMU]

Eh, it was a good series for the Cubs. They had a mini comeback today...not too shabby.


Still, big W for first Cubs/Sox meetup of the season! :D

[UCFish]

Yeah I am happy we won the series and tacked on a few more runs to make it not look as bad.

[cbotnyse]

Hey why don't you go spend some time in the White Sox thread... oh wait.:lol You're right, there is no White Sox thread on antsmarching.org. We must suck!

All right I'm out of this thread until June. We'll get you next time. Now on to more meaningful games....

[gocubsgo3822]

Dearest Cubs fans,

we are fixin to head out west. GUzman is going to the bullpen. Marshall is probably about to be starting. I think we need to disable howry or eyre and put marmol or guzman as the closer with dempster in mid relief. We will have three nasty lefties in the rotaition. Marshall has beenunhittable in his minor league rehab starts.Seriously Maddux really thought this kid was goingto be talented. He said the same thing about Marquis and he has done well. Not as well as lilly but not many nl pitchers have.

UCfish- the sox bullpen has been good all year but sucked this series.

-Quack Quack Quack

-Fuck the Redwings go Ducks (i want to see one fo my two favorite teams win a title.

[DMBCubs25]

Dearest Cubs fans,

we are fixin to head out west. GUzman is going to the bullpen. Marshall is probably about to be starting. I think we need to disable howry or eyre and put marmol or guzman as the closer with dempster in mid relief. We will have three nasty lefties in the rotaition. Marshall has beenunhittable in his minor league rehab starts.Seriously Maddux really thought this kid was goingto be talented. He said the same thing about Marquis and he has done well. Not as well as lilly but not many nl pitchers have.

UCfish- the sox bullpen has been good all year but sucked this series.

-Quack Quack Quack

-Fuck the Redwings go Ducks (i want to see one fo my two favorite teams win a title.

im pretty sure they said on csn postgame form what i heard that dempster was going to become the 5th starter which could be really really scary:eek and i dont think they would put marmol or guzman as the closer because they are young i could see them in middle relief for now, which would make (gasp) bob howry the closer which would only lead to more blown saves, so im really confused right now, hopefully we got more information before tuesdays game

[Ev42]

im pretty sure they said on csn postgame form what i heard that dempster was going to become the 5th starter which could be really really scary:eek and i dont think they would put marmol or guzman as the closer because they are young i could see them in middle relief for now, which would make (gasp) bob howry the closer which would only lead to more blown saves, so im really confused right now, hopefully we got more information before tuesdays game

:confused that would be a dumb move

[DMBCubs25]

:confused that would be a dumb move

i guess it was a false alarm becuase dempster and lou had a half hour meeting tonight, and dempster will be staying as the closer, still undecided on the 5th starter though, im guessing marshall

[Bron Yr Aur]

Guzman has done fine as the 5th starter in his two starts, I don't know why they feel the need to change things up immediately. That's my problem with Lou, we never have the same lineup, people are playing different positions every day, and now he's going to start messing with things that work.

[DMBCubs25]

Guzman has done fine as the 5th starter in his two starts, I don't know why they feel the need to change things up immediately. That's my problem with Lou, we never have the same lineup, people are playing different positions every day, and now he's going to start messing with things that work.

the reason guzman is going to the pen is because he cramped up in his last start and they want to shake up the bullpen right now because people like weurtz/ohman/howry/eyre/cotts have failed to do thier job on a consistent basis, im fine with guzman and marmol in the pen and marshall as the 5th starter, hopefully we dont blow as many leads now

[bothedmbfan]

When is Wood coming back?

[DMBCubs25]

When is Wood coming back?

who knows, apparently hes started throwing again so i guess its only a matter of time

[bothedmbfan]

who knows, apparently hes started throwing again so i guess its only a matter of time

Granted, he'll come back for like 3 games, look amazing, and then get bit by a rabid deer or something.

[UCFish]

Granted, he'll come back for like 3 games, look amazing, and then get bit by a rabid deer or something.

First of all yes that sounds about right. Please wherever we stay on the road do not let him have a room with a hottub.

Second please put your avatar back to Amy Jo. I hate it when people change their avatars all the time. It confuses the shit out of me.

[bothedmbfan]

First of all yes that sounds about right. Please wherever we stay on the road do not let him have a room with a hottub.

Second please put your avatar back to Amy Jo. I hate it when people change their avatars all the time. It confuses the shit out of me.

1. I agree with this.

2. I don't have the link for it anymore, but I'll find a new AJJ avatar, just for you.

[UCFish]

1. I agree with this.

2. I don't have the link for it anymore, but I'll find a new AJJ avatar, just for you.

Thank god. Not that N'Sync are not my boys but really I get confused.

Except Tiduwho. He always has the right Chicago Sports Avatar for the season. Although it never seems to pan out. :shrug

[bothedmbfan]

He should stop doing that, honestly, whenever he does put up a new one...we start to lose. :(

[Tiduwho]

Thank god. Not that N'Sync are not my boys but really I get confused.

Except Tiduwho. He always has the right Chicago Sports Avatar for the season. Although it never seems to pan out. :shrug

:(:(

[Tiduwho]

He should stop doing that, honestly, whenever he does put up a new one...we start to lose. :(


Don't be silly, I put them up at the perfect times. :lol

I put in Rex in August and what happened? 13 and 3 and the Super Bowl. I put the Bulls on in February and what happened? They went on a ridiculous run that put them at the #2 seed, unfortunately the Cavs kept winning as well. Swept Miami, we just weren't good enough to beat Detroit...this year. I'll admit my Wood/Prior combo to start last season didn't work out so well though, but who was expecting it to anyways with those guys? :lorraine


Once D Lee is healthy we will turn it around. It really seems like its just a matter of time...

I really really don't like all this Dempster in the rotation and Marmol/Guzman closing stuff though.

[UCFish]

:(:(

Hey I just get excited when it is Bears to win out and then the Bulls to come back. Maybe make one for Cubs to do better than last year and everything will be golden.

[UCFish]

He should stop doing that, honestly, whenever he does put up a new one...we start to lose. :(

Not as bad as my little bro gogocubsgo225 or whatever it is jinxing every good game the cubs have.

No offense bro.

[UCFish]

Don't be silly, I put them up at the perfect times. :lol

I put in Rex in August and what happened? 13 and 3 and the Super Bowl. I put the Bulls on in February and what happened? They went on a ridiculous run that put them at the #2 seed, unfortunately the Cavs kept winning as well. Swept Miami, we just weren't good enough to beat Detroit...this year. I'll admit my Wood/Prior combo to start last season didn't work out so well though, but who was expecting it to anyways with those guys? :lorraine


Once D Lee is healthy we will turn it around. It really seems like its just a matter of time...

I really really don't like all this Dempster in the rotation and Marmol/Guzman closing stuff though.

Those are good points. And yeah the Wood/Prior thing was no good but who knew just how bad that shit would end up turning out. You are 2/3 in my book. We just seem to fall a little short in the end. If Lee can stay healthy and increase the HR total I can see your current avatar coming true though. If he gets injured though change it to Lance Briggs for Game 1 :D .

[bothedmbfan]

Happy now?

[UCFish]

Happy now?

Nice work. Now I know who I am talking too. :D

[bothedmbfan]

Nice work. Now I know who I am talking too. :D

Amy Jo Johnson's #1 fan(and I will fight to the death for that title.)

[UCFish]

Hey if I was a betting man I would say she will knock on your front door in three two one......

[Tiduwho]

You know, I gotta admit. I'm really loving my D Lee right now. Just the perfect facial expression, size, and it looks conversational. Personality.

[bothedmbfan]

Derrek Lee is one of the most underrated players in baseball.

[Tiduwho]

Derrek Lee is one of the most underrated players in baseball.

The Definition of Underrated? JJ Hardy.


Check out ESPN's projected stats for him this year:

'07 JJ Hardy 63 Runs 14 HR 47 RBI .260


His current stats after a month and a half? :

'07 JJ Hardy 29 Runs 14 HR 40 RBI .316



Uhh........


Just watch though, he won't even make the All-Star game because fans will just vote for Rollins and Reyes.

[gocubsgo3822]

Not as bad as my little bro gogocubsgo225 or whatever it is jinxing every good game the cubs have.

No offense bro.
i have never jinxed them a day in their life.... I can not wait for the sean marshall era

:twenty4

[DMBZeppelin]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2877350

CHICAGO -- Ryan Dempster was all set to go from closer to starter. The switch was a short one.

After telling reporters Sunday how excited he was to join the Cubs' rotation, he was called in for a meeting with manager Lou Piniella. About 30 minutes later, Dempster returned to his locker with fresher news -- now he was staying in the bullpen.

"It's not like I went and started. Obviously, it seems weird," Dempster said.

Piniella had approached Dempster last week after the reliever gave up five runs in the ninth inning in a 6-5 loss to the Mets and asked him if he'd like to be a starter again.

With Florida and Cincinnati from 1998-2003, Dempster was primarily a starter and was in the Cubs rotation for six games in 2005 before making the switch to the bullpen and becoming the closer.

He saved 33 games that season in 35 chances and was 24-of-33 a year ago. He is 9-for-10 this season.

His initial conversation with Piniella went like this:

"He said, 'You want to start?' I said, 'Yeah.' So he said, 'I'll put you in the rotation,'" Dempster said before he was called into Piniella's office after Sunday's loss to the White Sox.

Dempster figured he'd throw a simulated game and then gradually build up his arm strength up so he could deliver more pitches and work more innings. And he was going to stay in the rotation.

"Everybody's angle is that if we're doing this, it's going to be a permanent thing. I'm not going to go start three or four games then go back and start closing again," he said.

He never got the chance.

The Cubs apparently want Dempster's experience as a reliever since they have young pitchers like Angel Guzman in the bullpen.

"The nice part is Lou told me you will start again, so I have that," Dempster said. "That's fine with me, as long as I know that. If it's sometime this season, if it's next year, if it's the year after that, I don't know," he said.

"I'm just going to go out there and do what they ask me to do."

Piniella wasn't available after Dempster's plans were changed again. But he said earlier making Dempster a starter had been discussed and so had all the ramifications that went with it.

[SatelliteEyes]

who knows, apparently hes started throwing again so i guess its only a matter of time

...before he gets hurt again.

[DMBZeppelin]

Nice Article on D-Lee:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=2877228

As celebrity spokespeople from Michael J. Fox to Katie Couric can attest, the process is rarely as simple as going out and choosing a cause.

More often than not, the cause chooses you.

Leber's Congenital Amaurosis reached out and tapped Derrek Lee's shoulder on Sept. 14, 2006, when he received a phone call from his wife telling him their 3-year-old daughter, Jada, was feeling discomfort in her right eye. Lee singled in four at-bats in a Chicago Cubs win over the Dodgers, then rushed off to the hospital for an update from the doctors.

When the test results came back the next day, Derrek and Christina Lee received the type of news every parent dreads: Jada was afflicted with LCA, a rare, inherited retinal disease typically found in children, and had suffered a substantial loss of vision in her right eye.

Some people lament their fate and others embark on the task of bringing about change. Barely two weeks after Jada's diagnosis, Lee was standing before a podium to announce he's in this fight as more than an innocent bystander.

Lee and Boston Celtics owner and CEO Wyc Grousbeck, whose teenage son also suffers from LCA, banded together to form Project 3000 in an effort to eradicate the disease. The immediate goal of the project, which works in conjunction with researchers at the University of Iowa, is to identify the estimated 3,000 LCA sufferers in the United States so they can undergo genetic testing. The total cost of the screenings is about $3 million, but it will take far more to fund clinical trials and additional research.

Lee, who leads the National League with a .394 batting average, is an established star for one of baseball's marquee franchises, so he's in a rare position to make his voice heard.

"We as athletes are able to reach a lot of people quicker than someone who might not get the media attention,'' Lee said. "When it's your daughter, you do what you can. It's a very rare disease, so 99 percent of the country hasn't heard of it. We just want to bring awareness to it.''

It's a task that is well-suited for Lee's temperament. The catch-all description of "good guy'' is tossed around so cavalierly that it's almost irrelevant in sports, but Lee possesses all the required attributes. As the son of a scout (Leon) and nephew of a former big leaguer (Leron), he knows how to act on the field, in the clubhouse and before the general public.

"He treats everybody the same as when he was hitting [.233] his rookie year in Florida,'' Cubs closer Ryan Dempster said. "Now he's hitting almost .400 and he's a Gold Glove first baseman and a batting champion, and he doesn't change. He's the exact same person.''

Lee's unflappable demeanor was tested during the 2006 season. His problems began when he hurt his left shoulder diving for a foul ball in the World Baseball Classic. Then he broke his right wrist in a collision with the Dodgers' Rafael Furcal on April 19 and was never quite the same.

After hitting .335 with 46 homers and 107 RBIs in a monster 2005 season, Lee went .286-8-30 in a mere 50 games. Without Lee, the Cubs dropped from ninth to 15th in the National League in runs scored.

"I just wasn't meant to be on the field last year,'' Lee said matter of factly.

Still, nothing could prepare him for the emotional trauma he experienced when he learned of his daughter's condition. Dr. Stephen Rose, chief research officer for the Foundation Fighting Blindness in Owings Mills, Md., says the field of vision of a child afflicted with LCA gradually shrinks to the size of a pinhole, like a camera lens shutting down. It's a more aggressive form of retinitis pigmentosa, the eye disease that caused longtime baseball executive Mike Veeck's daughter to go blind.

Researchers have identified nine genes that account for more than 70 percent of known LCA cases. That's why it's so important for LCA sufferers to be found, so they're in the pipeline in the event of medical advances and potential sight-saving treatments. The days of doctors' telling anxious parents to teach their children Braille and abandon hope of a better life are quickly becoming history.

"There's no magic bullet,'' Rose said, "but we're committed to finding treatments and cures so that no adult or child has to go blind. We're in the business to go out of business.''

The response by Lee's teammates to his plight is evidence of their respect and admiration for him. Cubs catcher Michael Barrett donated $50,000 and pledged an additional $10,000 for every homer he hits this season. Dempster donated $50,000 and pledged $1,000 for every strikeout he records.

When Dempster heard about Jada in September, he walked into the Cubs' family room and hugged his infant son and nearly cried. It's tempting, he says in hindsight, for professional athletes to lose touch when they're making millions of dollars, traveling first-class and playing before 40,000 fans every night. But when it comes to the most important issues, such as family and health, they're just as vulnerable as everyone else.

"It's humbling when something like this happens -- something so unfair,'' Dempster said. "For a beautiful, healthy child like that to suddenly start losing her eyesight is pretty tragic. If they can find a cure and stop it one day, that would be great.''

For now, Jada's energy helps her father through the daily grind. He's a mellow guy by nature and she's a miniature dynamo, smiling constantly and talking incessantly. Lee dotingly refers to her as "a little woman.''

As Jada, now 4, recently told her father, "Daddy, you're the big boss. But I'm the little boss.''

While Jada's vision loss is confined to the right eye, Lee arrives at the park each day with the realization that he could get another phone call with the distressing news that the problem has spread. Derrek and Christina Lee are conditioned to hope for the best and brace for the worst.

"It's always in my mind,'' Lee said. "It's scary. She has this disease and it causes severe vision loss, so it's a distinct possibility. But you can't be down all the time. She can sense our moods, so we have to stay upbeat for her.''

His professional stoicism notwithstanding, Lee is a competitor at heart. When his home run swing was missing in April, he kept lining doubles to the gap. And in the sanctuary of the dugout, his teammates see how much he cares.

"He wants to be in the lineup every day, and he competes,'' Cubs manager Lou Piniella says. "I enjoy watching him slam a helmet once in a while.''

In the end, Lee's story is about a little girl's spirit, her parents' love, and the baseball field and clubhouse providing an emotional haven. Maybe that combination is enough to generate some good from something so bad.

To learn more about Project 3000, click here. To learn more about the Foundation Fighting Blindness, click here.

Jerry Crasnick covers baseball for ESPN.com. His book "License To Deal" has been published by Rodale. Click here to order a copy. Jerry can be reached via e-mail.

[dmbinchicago]

When is Wood coming back?

:lol

Maybe never. He just threw for the first time in several months. He can't stay healthy for more than a few weeks. He's done.

[bothedmbfan]

Like I said, he'll come back for 3 games, be amazing, then get bit by a rabid deer.

[dmbinchicago]

No... these are not freak accidents. His shoulder is ruined. He is done.

[bothedmbfan]

I know, I'm just saying, that's what is going to happen.

[penn darvis]

Like I said, he'll come back for 3 games, be amazing, then get bit by a rabid deer.
Still more games than Prior will give the Cubs.

[Tiduwho]

No... these are not freak accidents. His shoulder is ruined. He is done.


Don't worry. He'll be back. Someday... :lorraine


D Lee is the man on and off the field indeed.

[DMBZeppelin]

Still more games than Prior will give the Cubs.
I'm not banking on it, but I'm not giving up on Prior. He's had freak injuries with running into Giles or the line drive to the throwing elbow. Last year was the year where he just wasn't the same. His velocity was down, ect. So his shoulder has probably been messed up for a while. I think this is Prior's first surgery. Unlike Wood who they usually know what's wrong with him and he gets surgery. I'm hoping that Prior can come back and be an effective pitcher.

For all your Prior haters read this:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&id=2851466&sportCat=mlb

CHICAGO -- Last May, as Albert Pujols (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6619) was single-handedly destroying our ozone layer with home run after home run, I flew to Kansas City for a Saturday evening game between the Royals and the St. Louis Cardinals (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=stl). Pujols hit a three-run dinger, the Cardinals won the game and both clubhouses genuflected in the direction of the Cards' first baseman.

But the postgame conversation I remember best had nothing to do with Pujols and everything to do with Chicago Cubs (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=chn) starter Mark Prior. Royals backup catcher Paul Bako, who spent two seasons with the Cubs, motioned me over to his locker.

"What's going on with Prior?" he said.

"He's hurt -- again," I said. "And you know how it is in there. I think some guys on that team think he's a wuss."
Bako was behind the plate the Oct. 14, 2003, night that Prior and the Cubs spectacularly unraveled in Game 6 of the National League Championship Series … you know, The Bartman Game. He was there in 2004, when Prior began his slow but full-fledged descent into disabled list hell. But last May, Bako was just like you and me: a Cubs outsider who wondered what had happened to the late, great career of Prior.

"You can say what you want about him," Bako said, "but when he got on the mound, he was a bulldog. A bulldog."

Turns out he was more than that. He was hurt. But nobody, including Prior, knew that his Calfzilla body was eroding slowly with each injury. Something, he told friends late in the 2004 season, "wasn't right," but he kept pitching. That was one of the constants about Prior: There was always so much mystery and intrigue associated with his injuries. You could never get a straight answer because there was none.

All that mercifully ended Tuesday -- or at least it should have -- when orthopedist Dr. James Andrews made his first incision into Prior's right shoulder. The arthroscopic surgery to repair the injured labrum was similar to the procedure performed by Andrews on NFL quarterback Drew Brees' throwing shoulder in 2006. And that turned out pretty well.

Prior will miss the entire 2007 season. What else is new? He made only nine starts a year ago, was a disabled list regular since being drafted No. 2 overall by the Cubs in 2001, and, if not for teammate Kerry Wood, he'd lead the team in Most Minor League Rehab Appearances. But there were times -- and no one can dispute this -- that Prior was the most dominant right-hander in the game.

Now, who knows? Baseball and the throwing shoulder were never meant for each other. Add surgery and Prior's rotten luck to the equation and you're left hoping for the best but expecting the worst.

"What I'm most pleased about is that we've identified the problem now," said Tom House, a former big league pitcher who has worked with Prior since Prior's freshman year of high school. "As far as I know, he had the best surgery available, he'll have the best rehab available, and the prognosis is he'll return and have a productive career. There's absolutely no reason he can't return to pre-injury form."

This must be a weird time for Prior. Imagine being hurt for the past several years, but no specialist or MRI (and there were dozens and dozens of them done) can explain exactly what's wrong. You see so many doctors that you ought to have your own show: "Prior's Anatomy." Mendoza Line hitters, the kind you used to baffle in three pitches, are getting base knocks. Then come those whispers when you hit the DL: You're not a gamer ... you might be jaking it.

Tuesday's surgery offers vindication and relief. But that doesn't mean Prior is whole again. His shoulder isn't the only thing recovering. His reputation is going to need time to heal.

"He's been judged when he's had a flat tire," said House, a close Prior friend who holds a doctorate in psychology and is co-founder of the San Diego-based National Pitching Association. "He's supposed to be a Ferrari. He's gone out with all the appearances of a Ferrari. But he couldn't perform like a Ferrari."

He did in 2003, when he won 18 games in his first full season and helped lead the Cubs to within five outs of their first World Series appearance since 1945. But then the Ferrari started having some engine problems.
"This is what happens in the game," House said. "When you can't find an answer, what do you do? You criticize the problem. Everybody wanted him to be healthy and productive. When it doesn't happen, what does everybody do?"

In this case, they slowly turned on Prior and his supposed physical frailty. That's why House said, "I think that it's probably time to clear up a bunch of stuff now that we have a resolution what is wrong."

According to the NPA's efficiency model, which is based on motion-analysis cameras that break down a pitcher's delivery to 600-1,000 frames per second, Prior's mechanics were "among the best who have ever thrown the ball," House said. And his conditioning program was "state of the art."

So if his pitching mechanics were nearly flawless, and his conditioning regimen was top-shelf, then what was the problem?
"The only other piece, it's got to be pitch totals," House said.
House emphasized that he's not "pointing fingers," but instead simply discussing science and the numbers. Prior threw 167 2/3 innings during his first season of pro ball, followed by 211 1/3 innings in 2003. He was a strikeout pitcher, which meant he often worked long and deep into pitch counts.

"This guy, everybody has had an opinion about," House said. "He's done everything possible ... to get healthy and pitch for the Chicago Cubs. You put personalities aside, all those things that don't matter, the only thing that a finger can be pointed at is pitch totals."

But if you're questioning Prior's workload, you're also questioning then-manager Dusty Baker (now an analyst for ESPN), and pitching coach Larry Rothschild and, to a lesser extent, general manager Jim Hendry. Prior threw 1,126 pitches in his last nine starts of 2003 (an average of 125 per game), including four outings with more than 130 pitches. But the Cubs were trying to win their first World Series title since 1908, and Prior won seven of those starts.

"Anything that comes out of my mouth ... this isn't sour grapes," House said. "I'm not trying to defend myself, not trying to defend Mark. I'm telling you this is what baseball does."

Baseball Prospectus, which publishes what amounts to an annual statistical research bible, details the effects of PAP -- Pitcher Abuse Point. Yeah, it's a seamhead thing, but in layman's terms, PAP is a way of predicting whether your arm is going to fall off if you keep putting up high pitch totals. It mostly shows short-term risk, but there's also a relationship between inflated pitch numbers and long-term risk.

So I called one of the co-authors of PAP research, Keith Woolner, a contributing writer for Baseball Prospectus. He looked up the 2003 PAP numbers. Kerry Wood had the second-highest PAP totals in the majors, Prior the fourth-highest.

"That's a pretty high load for a guy," Woolner said. "At a very young age, [Prior] was worked harder than almost every other pitcher in the baseball. He and Wood were two of the four most heavily worked pitchers in 2003. And almost immediately after that, [Prior] started experiencing problems."

Did Baker, who was in a no-win situation, contribute to derailing Prior's career? Some have written, or at least hinted, at that. Woolner won't go that far because the research isn't conclusive. The July 11, 2003, collision with infielder Marcus Giles might have contributed to the shoulder problems. And Prior was a workhorse at USC even before he got to the Cubs (he threw 357 college innings).

Nobody knows for sure.

But put it this way: The workload couldn't have helped. And another Baseball Prospectus contributor wrote recently that Prior's superb mechanics probably protected his shoulder from additional damage.

Prior is signed through 2007. If I were the Cubs, I'd try to re-sign him. If I were Prior, I'd agree to the deal. I don't know whether he'll ever be the Prior of 2003, but if House and Andrews are right, he also won't be the Prior of 2004, '05, '06 and '07 -- the Disabled Years.

Maybe he can do what Brees did: Start fresh (a new manager in Lou Piniella) and finish strong (the playoffs). It's the kind of happy ending a bulldog deserves.
Gene Wojciechowski is the senior national columnist for ESPN.com. You can contact him at gene.wojciechowski@espn3.com.

[DMBCubs25]

Sean marshall called up from iowa and will start tomorrow, neal cotts has been sent down to triple aaa, i like the move

[Ev42]

on cubs.com it's says miller will be back up this week. i wonder how long marshall will be up for then.

[UCFish]

Why Cotts. Why not dirtbag Eyre.

[DMBCubs25]

Why Cotts. Why not dirtbag Eyre.

I really wish I knew, at least its one of them because someone needs to be held accountable for their awful pitching, however I really never wanna see eyre pitch in any other situation other than mop-up duty

[gocubsgo3822]

Why Cotts. Why not dirtbag Eyre.

cotts had options and eyre would have to clear waivers and accept the demotion. Plus eyre has been pitching better as of late. Cotts's numbers are horrendous over the past 5-6 games. I am intrigued by marshall he has been lights out in the minors.

What the FUCK is wrong with Rich Hill??? Seriously he needs to get his shit together. I got off work at 10 tonight but Ron Santo was saying that he was hanging curves all over the place. FUCK...

I like having three lefthanders in the rotation and hope wade miller is cut.

-Tip of the day: WHen you give a bellman 5 bags that have an airline tag for being over fifty pounds it is not acceptable to tip the bellman two dollars. It really is not. Just think about that 250 pounds of baggage for 2 dollars. That is a dollar per 125 pounds. And then on the flip side 30 pounds of luggage was worth 5 dollars. People suck

-Go Cubs!

[DMBZeppelin]

What the FUCK is wrong with Rich Hill??? Seriously he needs to get his shit together. I got off work at 10 tonight but Ron Santo was saying that he was hanging curves all over the place. FUCK...
I don't know if this is the problem, but it might be mechanics. Earlier in the year Hill was dominating as you know. One problem he has is his super slow delievery. So he gave up a lot of stolen bases. So the Cubs decided to tweak his delievery. He now has two. A quick step that he does, or the high leg wind. He usually uses the quick step with runners on base. Now it doesn't excuse his pitching, but it can't help using two delieveries. He used both tonight for example. I don't know what he was using when he gave up the homers.

[UCFish]

-Tip of the day: WHen you give a bellman 5 bags that have an airline tag for being over fifty pounds it is not acceptable to tip the bellman two dollars. It really is not. Just think about that 250 pounds of baggage for 2 dollars. That is a dollar per 125 pounds. And then on the flip side 30 pounds of luggage was worth 5 dollars. People suck

-Go Cubs![/QUOTE]

When they tip you that low you have to shit in their bags!!!!

[DMBCubs25]

whats happened to rich hill, that first inning he had yesterday was the worst control pitching to start a game i think ive ever seen

[Tiduwho]

whats happened to rich hill, that first inning he had yesterday was the worst control pitching to start a game i think ive ever seen

I think that dual delivery that Zep was talking about could be a factor there.

[Ev42]

what do you think they will do with miller if Sean Marshall has a good start.

[UCFish]

Bullpen?

[DMBCubs25]

what do you think they will do with miller if Sean Marshall has a good start.

release hopefully, hes a terrible pitcher, we dont need any injured washed up pitchers that throw 85 mph on this team anymore

[Ev42]

release hopefully, hes a terrible pitcher, we dont need any injured washed up pitchers that throw 85 mph on this team anymore

i hope. his last start was not good at all i have no idea why they are bringing him back up

[UCFish]

Well at least Marshall pitched well. Another 1 run loss.

[Ev42]

another crap game. this is going to be one long ass season

[Tiduwho]

Bullshit fucking offense. Fucking shit. Everyone but DeRosa can suck a dick. God Damnit, that's bullshit. Fucking Marshall in the ass like that you POS hitters. God damnit!!IOJOI:FSJDIFOJDSOFJDSOJo;

[DMBZeppelin]

I just hope they keep Marshall in the rotation. Minus when he pitched hurt towards the end of last season. He was pretty solid. Heck even though he gave up the home run. He managed to finish off the innining. Usually it seems like when it rains it pours with this team. I just don't want to send Marshall to AAA because Miller/Cotts/Dempster are making the money.

Cotts is starting in AAA in case anyone didn't know. Long term plan is to get Dempster in the rotation after he mentors Guzman. Also if anyone remember my comment early about Marshall's mechanics. Len and Bob brought that up. They are now working on a third throwing motion. One that is a cross between the high leg kick (his natural one) and the new quick step they implemented.

[DMBCubs25]

why do we have a fuckin midget playing shortstop, izturis coudlnt hit a homerun if his life depended on it, the fence could be 275 and i still dont think he would come near the warning track. Murton sucks at baserunning, at least jones didnt play, and marshall pitched a hell of a ballgame, plus i know im getting a win in fantasy tongiht because chris young is pitching for me

[UCFish]

Well we tied it up in the seventh. How will this pan out?

[UCFish]

Taken the lead. YAY!!!