From an older perspective after hearing entire vh1

[jaazzman]

For whatever its worth I wanted to post in this forum which I don't do too often. I have been involved w/ music (playing, recording, working in the music business) for over 30 years (you can guess I am a little older)
After giving the album an entire listen, I feel pretty much as I did after hearing everyday. I am quite disappointed and probably had high hopes like many of you after hearing and witnessing several performances of crazy easy, good good time, joy ride and hello again.
This new release feels incredibly overproduced, and having been a seasoned drummer am quite disappointed w/ Carter's recording (whether that is Pro Tools to blame or batson)
The saving grace on this release for me was at the end when I heard hunger for the great light, this brought me back to the late 90's and BTCS. For me personally this was the high I was looking for and feel this is the best tune on the cd. (For me it was So Right on everyday, an awesome underplayed tune)
While many of the younger fans in this forum may not understand where I am coming from, this is quite disappointing for those of us that saw dave in virginia since 1992 and followed him throughout his career. (My personal favorites will always be Lie in our graves, Typical Situation, Best of What's around, Dancing Nancies (w/ Leroi taking over, not boyd), #41, Pig, Say Goodbye, Two Step, Captain, Grey St, and Grace is Gone)
I am open and giving this new release another listen as I type, but unfortunately I would welcome the band either producing it on their own or going back to some of the more seasoned (less pop/teeny sensation) producers.
thanks
I welcome your comments, specially from some of the older fans

[il bacio dolce]

It seems to be generally loved by fans, and everyone is relieved to find it's not like Everyday.

[dmbosw41]

yeah dont know what your talkin about dude....this album is their new STUDIO album effort and its fabulous!! Much better than Everyday! It rocks!

[ICantBelieveDMB]

You do make some good points, and it just sounds different because these songs were made in the studio (minus Hello Again)...While the songs from years before were road tested and have gone that direction. They probably will sound a lot better live, when we hear them as being longer and giving individual band members their share time to tear shit up.

[HolyCow]

I don't like when "older" fans feel like they know more about DMB and what is good and bad. Just because I am 19 and have only been a fan for about 5 years doesn't mean I can't appreciate good music when I hear it.

[Tyggress]

I find it interesting that the older fans seem to keep comparing everything with BTCS. Yes, that was a great album...but this is now and that was then. I haven't heard the whole album yet...only the clips so far. But, everyone seems to be really excited about the new album and everyone, for the most part, is saying they love it.

I am an older fan who appreciates the love for BTCS...but I wish some older fans would give it a rest already. If you loved BTCS so much, then go listen to it over and over again...but don't expect that every album since then is going to sound just like that one.

This is a different album and a different time for the band.

[brydro]

:thumbsup I find it interesting that the older fans seem to keep comparing everything with BTCS. Yes, that was a great album...but this is now and that was then. I haven't heard the whole album yet...only the clips so far. But, everyone seems to be really excited about the new album and everyone, for the most part, is saying they love it.

I am an older fan who appreciates the love for BTCS...but I wish some older fans would give it a rest already. If you loved BTCS so much, then go listen to it over and over again...but don't expect that every album since then is going to sound just like that one.

This is a different album and a different time for the band.

:thumbsup I couldnt have said it better!

[Badger41]

I'm an older fan as well and from I gather most of us (those in my cohort) felt something great growing with this band. The shows in the late 90's were building and you could sense something fantastic was going to explode, that this band had the potential to be phenomenal. I think everything was building to a head and for some reason a lot of us feel 2000 was the "peak" of DMB. However we did not know that at the time, only in retrospect do we think that.

I've listened to all the songs a couple times and they're enjoyable. It's their band and they can take it the way they want to go, but for whatever reason I feel in my humble opinion that the band has already peaked musically and is now only trying to enjoy the fun and commercial downhill ride as their careers come to an end (whenever that it is).

It seems that DMB is no longer a band that deconstructs musical binaries, but simply a popular band that still has tons of commercial appeal.

[Isilinde]

I don't like when "older" fans feel like they know more about DMB and what is good and bad. Just because I am 19 and have only been a fan for about 5 years doesn't mean I can't appreciate good music when I hear it.

AMEN!
I'm right on the same page with you.

Why are we supposedly lesser fans because we're younger and have only been fans for 5 years or so?....
This irks me.

[Mouchie]

I'm an older fan as well and from I gather most of us (those in my cohort) felt something great growing with this band. The shows in the late 90's were building and you could sense something fantastic was going to explode, that this band had the potential to be phenomenal. I think everything was building to a head and for some reason a lot of us feel 2000 was the "peak" of DMB. However we did not know that at the time, only in retrospect do we think that.

I've listened to all the songs a couple times and they're enjoyable. It's their band and they can take it the way they want to go, but for whatever reason I feel in my humble opinion that the band has already peaked musically and is now only trying to enjoy the fun and commercial downhill ride as their careers come to an end (whenever that it is).

It seems that DMB is no longer a band that deconstructs musical binaries, but simply a popular band that still has tons of commercial appeal.

I couldnt Agree more. NOT!!!!!!!
Dave Matthews Band has eveything they had when they started. The still try new instruments and want to play for fans. Sure they might be getting old but think of it if you were on the Road most of your life you would need a break to. But remember you dont realize what you have till its gone so when DMB does decide to leave you will be like man there gone and i should have enjoyed it was they were here and Dave feels the same way when he is gone he will miss it and come back good as new..

[pickdog]

I have been a fan since 1994 and I welcome a change. Don't get me wrong, their best shows are from 1993-5 when I used to get them from a friend and they were on tapes. I wish they could have recoreded this album last year when they were back towards finding the old roots but I think the album may have been to political b/c that was a political time. I think they wanted to try something new and this is it. I think these songs will evolve live and I see many parts in these songs that they could go into a jam. They will make it work. I have faith and personally I don't mind the album. Just like in 1998 w/ BTCS, I liked it at first but now I can't get enough of it and its my fav. album. Give it a few listens.

[Orpheus]

It seems to be generally loved by fans, and everyone is relieved to find it's not like Everyday.

:thumbsup Nail. Head.

[HolyCow]

AMEN!
I'm right on the same page with you.

Why are we supposedly lesser fans because we're younger and have only been fans for 5 years or so?....
This irks me.

Exactly. Older fans feel like they have some "right" to gripe about a change because they know about DMB....irks me too.

[twosteppn36]

hunger for the great light doesnt remind me of btcs at all

[slymshady626]

Well I have only been a fan for about 3 years but after listening to Stand up 3 or so times it is obvious that this is just not as good musically as UTTAD, crash, BTCS, or busted stuff no matter what direction the band is taking...I still like this album and i know its not fair to compare it to BTCS but you have to at least admit that carter's drumming and both dave's vocal's and lyrics are not as good as they could be...BTCS was almost completely different than UTTAD and that was a band evolving....stand up is just a band recording a bunch of songs for the sake of getting songs done with a producer that while yes he has a great musical backround, he still shows that he has just completed work with many rappers...examples being stand up and the 3 or 4 songs that play the same guitar riff throughout the ENTIRE song....hmm one beat and riff played through an entire song...sounds like a rap song to me

[DTRFFdmb]

It seems that DMB is no longer a band that deconstructs musical binaries, but simply a popular band that still has tons of commercial appeal.

i think this sentence sums up everthing about this album.

and it is alot like ED. It is overproduced, fake drums, not very good lyrics, and everything is on the verge of being noise not greatly constructed music.

DMB is great now, but they were amazing. They have changed and that is essential for a band, but this new direction is somewhat typical of the direction of music nowadays.

what this album will bring is more radio fans that are going to be talking through the great jams of two step and talk during dreaming tree and will cheer and sing when american baby is played.

everyone complains about the fans at some of the concerts and albums like this and everyday are the reasons why those fans are there.

[goochylittlepig]

For whatever its worth I wanted to post in this forum which I don't do too often. I have been involved w/ music (playing, recording, working in the music business) for over 30 years (you can guess I am a little older)
After giving the album an entire listen, I feel pretty much as I did after hearing everyday. I am quite disappointed and probably had high hopes like many of you after hearing and witnessing several performances of crazy easy, good good time, joy ride and hello again.
This new release feels incredibly overproduced, and having been a seasoned drummer am quite disappointed w/ Carter's recording (whether that is Pro Tools to blame or batson)
The saving grace on this release for me was at the end when I heard hunger for the great light, this brought me back to the late 90's and BTCS. For me personally this was the high I was looking for and feel this is the best tune on the cd. (For me it was So Right on everyday, an awesome underplayed tune)
While many of the younger fans in this forum may not understand where I am coming from, this is quite disappointing for those of us that saw dave in virginia since 1992 and followed him throughout his career. (My personal favorites will always be Lie in our graves, Typical Situation, Best of What's around, Dancing Nancies (w/ Leroi taking over, not boyd), #41, Pig, Say Goodbye, Two Step, Captain, Grey St, and Grace is Gone)
I am open and giving this new release another listen as I type, but unfortunately I would welcome the band either producing it on their own or going back to some of the more seasoned (less pop/teeny sensation) producers.
thanks
I welcome your comments, specially from some of the older fans

i understand where you're coming from, but dmb has always had a bunch of sappy tunes (crash into me, lover lay down, satellite, etc etc) this album has a couple, too. but it's a studio production. btcs was very well done, but their earlier stuff just sounds sparser in the studio cuz they didnt really know what they were doing, i think. listen the actual studio songs from r2t and uttad. they have studio effects but it's just sort of simplistic. i personally like what ive heard so far, but the real test is how they turn out live. if i judged songs by their album sound, i wouldnt like most of the songs i do.

sorry you're disappointed, but im confused as to why a number of posts act like they were promised btcs b-sides interspersed with the summer songs, and are totally surprised by the album. this newer sound has already been discussed to death. it's sort of annoying to read post after post of "this is embarassing, this sucks, omg" when you didnt like anything at any point along the line. most of us have at least some likes and dislikes about this album, and are having reactions to the stuff that hadnt been heard in clips, etc. i wish people could kind of stick to that.

[CryFrdm41]

"Everyday things change... basically they stay the same", right. That's what he said anyway, back in the day when he had magic in his lyrics, and soul in his voice. This album is over-engineered shit... I was listening to it, and a coworker said "is that Boys To Men?" And, it might as well be. The sticker that's been on my car is coming off this afternoon. Hope you all enjoy the tour/album, and hopefully... god, I've said that word too many times in the last few years referring to this band... anyway... hopefully in a few years they'll put out something worth listening to, and supporting... until then, I'm done.

[brydro]

"Everyday things change... basically they stay the same", right. That's what he said anyway, back in the day when he had magic in his lyrics, and soul in his voice. This album is over-engineered shit... I was listening to it, and a coworker said "is that Boys To Men?" And, it might as well be. The sticker that's been on my car is coming off this afternoon. Hope you all enjoy the tour/album, and hopefully... god, I've said that word too many times in the last few years referring to this band... anyway... hopefully in a few years they'll put out something worth listening to, and supporting... until then, I'm done.

Your taking the sticker off of your car? :lol :lol Wow...You could always put BTCS on repeat for the rest of your life, and keep the cool sticker!

[fn41dmb]

How boring would your job be if every day for well over a decade you came in and they had you do the same thing every single day, and when you tried something a little different you had thousands of people screaming at you. The simple fact is that these guys, like all of us, need to grow and experiment in their lives, otherwise what's the point.
The thing about DMB that I find so appealing is not a few songs that they sing, but that they genuinely love music, and not just one type, but all types of music. I mentioned this a while back in another thread, but I remember watching the special with Dave and Trey in Africa, and he was talking about how much he loved the fact that their culture embrased music as music, not how we do here where everything is about what "type" of music... rap, country, etc.
I think there has been a lot of talk about how this band is trying to bring their music to the "mainstream masses", but I think it is more about creating MUSIC, whatever it sounds like. I think that every album they have put out represents that love of music, it seems as though it has always been about a group of guys who have gone into a studio and recorded music and lyrics that in some way have grabbed at them.

One last comment, and then I'll shut up. I don't think that it is fair to judge a fan by how long they have been listening. I understand the feeling of being part of something before anyone else was. I have been a fan for 10 years now, and I still learn something new about this band all the time. I can promise you that there are members on these boards that have been fans for only a couple of years that probably know more about the music and the members than I may ever know. I find it ironic that some "older fans" sit in judgement of "newer fans" saying that they only like the new stuff, when they rant and rave about how nothing will ever compare with the "old stuff".
Ok, I'm done. Thanks for listening

[DTRFFdmb]

Your taking the sticker off of your car? :lol :lol Wow...You could always put BTCS on repeat for the rest of your life, and keep the cool sticker!

unfortunately that is not the band anymore. this is.

is this what you want people to hear when they listen to DMB?

[Tyggress]

...examples being stand up and the 3 or 4 songs that play the same guitar riff throughout the ENTIRE song....hmm one beat and riff played through an entire song...sounds like a rap song to me

This from a person whose screen name is derived from Eminem....who was also produced by Batson. :rolleyes

[brydro]

unfortunately that is not the band anymore. this is.

is this what you want people to hear when they listen to DMB?

You need to relax man, if you dont like the new stuff thats fine, no one is pushing it on you, but if you were a fan of the first 3 to 4 albums, why would you take a sticker off of your car, you are on these boards because you are a fan, if one album makes you forget all the things that they have done in the past then maybe you werent a fan at all. Please dont take what I am saying personal, but come on, if you loved the old stuff, then you are still a fan, you just dont like the new material.

[CryFrdm41]

Your taking the sticker off of your car? :lol :lol Wow...You could always put BTCS on repeat for the rest of your life, and keep the cool sticker!

So clever... I don't know how you pompous fucks keep coming up with such witty responses. Look around you, they're all over. Keep it up everybody!! :thumbsup

[ishuman]

"Everyday things change... basically they stay the same", right. That's what he said anyway, back in the day when he had magic in his lyrics, and soul in his voice. This album is over-engineered shit... I was listening to it, and a coworker said "is that Boys To Men?" And, it might as well be. The sticker that's been on my car is coming off this afternoon. Hope you all enjoy the tour/album, and hopefully... god, I've said that word too many times in the last few years referring to this band... anyway... hopefully in a few years they'll put out something worth listening to, and supporting... until then, I'm done.

:lorraine

[brydro]

So clever... I don't know how you pompous fucks keep coming up with such witty responses. Look around you, they're all over. Keep it up everybody!! :thumbsup

Get over it man, Take your sticker off, dont go to the shows..Whatever.

[ishuman]

So clever... I don't know how you pompous fucks keep coming up with such witty responses. Look around you, they're all over. Keep it up everybody!! :thumbsup


:lorraine Get some tissue man.

[Tyggress]

I remember watching the special with Dave and Trey in Africa, and he was talking about how much he loved the fact that their culture embrased music as music, not how we do here where everything is about what "type" of music... rap, country, etc.


I remember that comment, and was equally struck by it...it's so true. In other parts of the world, many different types of music are ALL enjoyed, for the sake of being MUSIC. And here in the States, we're so boxed in with only liking certain types of music....when all different types of music should be apreciated for what it is.

Music truly is a universal language, being that it's based in math...no matter where you are, musicians everywhere all play off the same notes, measures, etc....it's all the same....and they all have an appreciation for each other and the music they play....it's all about the MUSIC.

[NoBigThing2004]

"I'm older and have an opinion..."
"oh yeah, well I'm 19 and like ive listend for 5 years. i know them as well as you, your opinion doesnt matter"
"yeah me too"
"oh yeah well i use cool acronyms to talk about everything"
"oh yeah well i made them"
"oh yeah well i am dave matthews"
"oh yeah well i gave birth to him"

who cares? you're ridiculous.

and all i know is that i don't much care for this album either, and maybe if i say that i am creator of the universe my opinion will carry some weight. maybe itll grow on me. who cares who is more "dave" shut the hell up and just enjoy the music.

[CryFrdm41]

You need to relax man, if you dont like the new stuff thats fine, no one is pushing it on you, but if you were a fan of the first 3 to 4 albums, why would you take a sticker off of your car, you are on these boards because you are a fan, if one album makes you forget all the things that they have done in the past then maybe you werent a fan at all. Please dont take what I am saying personal, but come on, if you loved the old stuff, then you are still a fan, you just dont like the new material.

I'm taking the sticker off my car because I don't want to be associated with this band or... it's fans (but, that's nothing new... I haven't liked the majority of fans for years). I do love the old stuff, and always will... but like I said, until anything worth my time/effort/money is released, I'm done supporting DMB.

[brydro]

I'm taking the sticker off my car because I don't want to be associated with this band or... it's fans (but, that's nothing new... I haven't liked the majority of fans for years). I do love the old stuff, and always will... but like I said, until anything worth my time/effort/money is released, I'm done supporting DMB.

Sorry that you feel that way, but it still makes no sense to me, the fact that this album has made you want to not be associated with the band is sad..Goodbye.

[johnbro23]

DMB has been my favorite band ever since BTCS came out in 1998. I'm not one of the older fans here, but I do have the same love for all their music as an older fan does, and I'd have to say, this album is great. Not even comparable to ED. But I have to admit, I don't think its comparable to BTCS.

[taphntm]

I find it interesting that the older fans seem to keep comparing everything with BTCS. Yes, that was a great album...but this is now and that was then. I haven't heard the whole album yet...only the clips so far. But, everyone seems to be really excited about the new album and everyone, for the most part, is saying they love it.

I am an older fan who appreciates the love for BTCS...but I wish some older fans would give it a rest already. If you loved BTCS so much, then go listen to it over and over again...but don't expect that every album since then is going to sound just like that one.

This is a different album and a different time for the band.

:thumbsup

I'm not an older fan myself. I respect the "older" opinions, but I disagree. I really don't think there is a song on BTCS that is the least bit comparable to some songs on the other albums such as Two Step, BOWA, So Right or Grey St. I'll go as far as to say none of my top 5 favorite songs are on BTCS. Every CD is good in it's own way, sometimes I can't stand listening to BTCS and sometimes it's just what I want to hear. It's just whatever mood of music you're into at the moment.

But I respect your opinion jazzman.

[pickdog]

"I'm older and have an opinion..."
"oh yeah, well I'm 19 and like ive listend for 5 years. i know them as well as you, your opinion doesnt matter"
"yeah me too"
"oh yeah well i use cool acronyms to talk about everything"
"oh yeah well i made them"
"oh yeah well i am dave matthews"
"oh yeah well i gave birth to him"

who cares? you're ridiculous.

and all i know is that i don't much care for this album either, and maybe if i say that i am creator of the universe my opinion will carry some weight. maybe itll grow on me. who cares who is more "dave" shut the hell up and just enjoy the music.


good first post. why has it taken u so long to post? i m not knocking u but you have been member for almost a year

[CryFrdm41]

Sorry that you feel that way, but it still makes no sense to me, the fact that this album has made you want to not be associated with the band is sad..Goodbye.

It really is............ goodbye.

[chrisandiego]

Jaaaazzman- appreciate your honesty in the first post. Interesting to hear where you are coming from.
I have listened to the band since 1997, and I am very happy with this final product. The best thing about this band (IMO) is that all of their albums have been different. It's amazing what a wide range of musical genres they have explored over the years. I guess I just feel sorry for people who aren't happy with their new stuff, because I surely am, and I would like everyone to be as satisfied as I am with Stand Up. But then again, these boards would be pretty boring if no one differed in opinion.

[dmbosw41]

its cliche' that all the "old" fans come on here and say their speal about how this album is not what they wanted. I dont know what the guy is talking about saying it sounds like Boyz 2 men. It doesnt. That is just foolish. yeah Old dirt hill has that boy band sound and I think its the worst song on the album but it doesnt make the whole thing or general sound bad. Everyone knew from the first interivews with stefan in 03 that this band would be more hip hop. Thats why they went with Batson. Just get over it. This album has a great mixture of pop/rock and R&B songs. Afterall, the band made a decision many years back that they would still make records despite reaching their musical peak. They want to stay relevent in pop culture and this is the way to do it. Who knows maybe their next album will be some awesome new wave record or maybe it will sound like Genesis when they hit their peak in 1986. Who cares....everyone that is a true fan knows that DMB is at their best in a live setting. I will buy Stand Up and listen to it a few times and then shelve it and wait to see the songs evolve live.

[il bacio dolce]

So how many rep points did you lose, jaazzman? I lost one for a comment about Dave's voice being shot because of his smoking. :rolleyes I'm a troll for saying such an untrue thing, right? Why is it so bad to make one slightly negative remark?

[NoBigThing2004]

thanks pickdog.

i don't know why its taken me a while. i enjoy most of the people here. i just usually have nothing to say. but i do enjoy everyone's opinions on the new album. like and dislike whatever you want. dmb will always rocks.

[HolyCow]

I am not saying that older opinions don't matter. But older DMB membes feel that wehat they have to say bears more importance. Everyone has the right to say what they think. But to feel that because you are an "older" member that for some reason you know the band better and know what is good and bad....i think we have all heard the same albums. Just because you heard UTTAD three years before I did, doesn't mean you know it better.

I am not trying to pick a fight....just saying what I think.

[corkyflad]

unfortunately that is not the band anymore. this is.

is this what you want people to hear when they listen to DMB?

I listen to DMB because I like them, not to get other people to like me.

[Lcsulla]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares? I like Paul Simon but didn't see him until 2001, does that make me less of a fan? I don't think so. We all like what we like. Personally a lot of this album I dig quite a bit. Is it BTCS? Is it UTTAD? Is it Crash? No, it's Stand Up. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

I've been seeing DMB since before their last Roseland shows and I don't plan on disassociating myself with them, quite the contrary actually. I'm psyched for Roseland, Hartford, SPAC, and whatever else I can swing this summer. For all of you old fans who are writing off DMB please do some of my 'newer' fan friends a favor and cancel your WH accounts so those new fans can get the chance to sit up close and see DMB.

[HolyCow]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares? I like Paul Simon but didn't see him until 2001, does that make me less of a fan? I don't think so. We all like what we like. Personally a lot of this album I dig quite a bit. Is it BTCS? Is it UTTAD? Is it Crash? No, it's Stand Up. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

I've been seeing DMB since before their last Roseland shows and I don't plan on disassociating myself with them, quite the contrary actually. I'm psyched for Roseland, Hartford, SPAC, and whatever else I can swing this summer. For all of you old fans who are writing off DMB please do some of my 'newer' fan friends a favor and cancel your WH accounts so those new fans can get the chance to sit up close and see DMB.

Very very good post. +1 for this.

[smudge1]

"Everyday things change... basically they stay the same", right. That's what he said anyway, back in the day when he had magic in his lyrics, and soul in his voice. This album is over-engineered shit... I was listening to it, and a coworker said "is that Boys To Men?" And, it might as well be. The sticker that's been on my car is coming off this afternoon. Hope you all enjoy the tour/album, and hopefully... god, I've said that word too many times in the last few years referring to this band... anyway... hopefully in a few years they'll put out something worth listening to, and supporting... until then, I'm done.I hope you are giving up your WH membership also. :)

[lillerfm]

Well, I'm an older fan and I think it's great. I think that the songs have already proven themselves, at least to me at Jazzfest last weekend, as been abole to be carried off live on stage. I don't think it's overproduced but I do agree that the band memebers might have been buried a litte here...but we all know that's not the way that it is...think of it like this, if this record is a launching pad for a new slew of songs to be played live then so be it. And honestly, do you think that Crazy Easy, Joy Ride, and Sugar Will are dead? Nope, they just became the new Granny, Help Myself, and Get In Line...which, imo, makes it more special when they are played live.

I'm a fan of this album...

[krbarrett77]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares? I like Paul Simon but didn't see him until 2001, does that make me less of a fan? I don't think so. We all like what we like. Personally a lot of this album I dig quite a bit. Is it BTCS? Is it UTTAD? Is it Crash? No, it's Stand Up. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

I've been seeing DMB since before their last Roseland shows and I don't plan on disassociating myself with them, quite the contrary actually. I'm psyched for Roseland, Hartford, SPAC, and whatever else I can swing this summer. For all of you old fans who are writing off DMB please do some of my 'newer' fan friends a favor and cancel your WH accounts so those new fans can get the chance to sit up close and see DMB.



Post= Perfection

(To me) right on the $

[lillerfm]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares?

People have been bitching about this disparity for the last 6 or 7 years...it'll never change..

still...great post though...

[CryFrdm41]

I hope you are giving up your WH membership also. :)

Nah... I think I'll keep that so I can buy and scalp tickets. Thanks for the advise, though. ;)

Actually, I gave it up about two years ago.

[JerseyKinghjc]

i understand where you're coming from, but dmb has always had a bunch of sappy tunes (crash into me, lover lay down, satellite, etc etc) this album has a couple, too. but it's a studio production. btcs was very well done, but their earlier stuff just sounds sparser in the studio cuz they didnt really know what they were doing, i think. listen the actual studio songs from r2t and uttad. they have studio effects but it's just sort of simplistic. i personally like what ive heard so far, but the real test is how they turn out live. if i judged songs by their album sound, i wouldnt like most of the songs i do.

sorry you're disappointed, but im confused as to why a number of posts act like they were promised btcs b-sides interspersed with the summer songs, and are totally surprised by the album. this newer sound has already been discussed to death. it's sort of annoying to read post after post of "this is embarassing, this sucks, omg" when you didnt like anything at any point along the line. most of us have at least some likes and dislikes about this album, and are having reactions to the stuff that hadnt been heard in clips, etc. i wish people could kind of stick to that.

:thumbsup I feel this statement a 100%. Especially when you said, "the real test is how they turn out live. if i judged songs by their album sound, i wouldnt like most of the songs i do." That's how I judge all music in general. Sure I'll have my dislikes and what not, but doesn't everyone? Also on the side note: To those who had such a negative vibe towards the band , and their doubts on SU over the past months or so. CAN NOW JOIN THE REST OF US WHO HAVE BEEN 100% SUPPORTIVE, AND GET THE FACT THAT, THE BAND IS MOVING ON INTO DIFFERENT DIRECTION(S) WITH THEIR MUSIC. SO BASICALLY WHAT I'M SAYING IS. WATCH FOR ALL THESE POSITIVE POST'S START BLOWING UP FROM ALL THE HATERS BANDWAGON/PEANUT GALLERY. SO IF YOU'RE ONE OF THEM, IT'S OK, CUZ "IT'S OUT OF MY HANDS FOR NOW, IT'S OUT OF MY HANDS FOR NOW". That's all for now ladies & Gents. Oh If I by anychance piss somebody off with my Bandwagon comment, I'm sorry, but it's the TRUTH :haha :haha :haha . LATE

"Now our finest hour Arrives" :monkey Cheers, Hec

[quick turtle]

I can stomach a few tunes on the album but I think it is sub-par and can't waste my money on it.

what really gets me about the whole situation is fact how damn good last year's summer songs were -- not simply because they were road tested, but because they were songs that evolved naturally from the band doing what they do best.

People argue that it would be boring for the band to keep doing the same things over and over and they have to do something new, but this crap feels forced to me from the lyrics to the music.

I have no problem with the band doing new things, obviously its their band not mine and they don't owe me anything. Selfishly though I wish they could evolve naturally without having to bring in a producer to do it for them.

[ryguy178]

I just think people are under the impression you have to like this. I personally, don't dislike it. Its obviously not the best thing they've done, I'm not mushing all over the album, but it is decent, very ear friendly and listenable. There are 2 or 3 gems and keepers on this (Namely for me, Dreamgirl, Out Of My Hands, Steady as we Go). What I realy dislike though is that there seems to be a lack of honest opinion. Everyone is blinded by the fact that this is DMB and thus you are required to like it. God forbid anyone post a negative comment, or we disown them as a DMB fan.

[som3d3vil34]

I have been involved w/ music (playing, recording, working in the music business) for over 30 years

Then you should know that musicians have to move foward with their music and try new things or they are just...stuck.

Thats how I feel about it anyways. I just got through Stolen Away on my quest to hear the full album, and so far Im really really liking, if not loving, it.

[DollyLlama]

Well, I usually like stuff more after I hear it a few times, but for the moment, I don't think Stand Up is very good.

My first impression is that it's just too overproduced. Too much electronic funny business with Dave's voice, fade ins/outs, and so forth.

Lyrically, too much of it sounds like stuff Cartman's going to use for the next Faith+1 album.

I also don't care for the arranging. A big part of what makes DMB great for me was that you essentially had two percussionists laying down a groove - Dave's guitar work and Carter on drums. Really, it all started with Dave's guitar work for me, and Carter's additions and the interplay between the two of them made it that much more amazing.

But, the songwriting was such that Dave's songs could stand on their own. Everyone else was just a very nice bonus. I think that's why we get excited about Dave and Tim tours and why I personally still watch my Benaroya Hall DVD on a regular basis. I just don't think I can say the same thing about the songwriting on Stand Up.

Again, it will probably grow on me after I hear it a few times, but every other DMB album I've heard has made me say "holy shit! that's awesome!" and grew on me from there.

[penn darvis]

Everyone is blinded by the fact that this is DMB and thus you are required to like it. God forbid anyone post a negative comment, or we disown them as a DMB fan.

The hypocrisy is really unbearable. It's perfectly alright to hate ED, but with this album, the band is "moving in a new direction" and people are just supposed to accept that and get over it.

[haildmb]

I find it interesting that the older fans seem to keep comparing everything with BTCS. Yes, that was a great album...but this is now and that was then. I haven't heard the whole album yet...only the clips so far. But, everyone seems to be really excited about the new album and everyone, for the most part, is saying they love it.

I am an older fan who appreciates the love for BTCS...but I wish some older fans would give it a rest already. If you loved BTCS so much, then go listen to it over and over again...but don't expect that every album since then is going to sound just like that one.

This is a different album and a different time for the band.


it's impossible to not compare any artist's work with their absolute best. This goes for musicians, authors, directors, actors, etc. In many people's opinions (mine included), BTCS is far and away the best album DMB has offered. I can't help but compare everything to it.

I've only listened to the first few songs on this cd. It is different, so far I like it alright... but it's not the same as their old stuff. That's okay, it's also okay that I and/or others don't like it as much, or like it at all.

[Rippy]

The hypocrisy is really unbearable. It's perfectly alright to hate ED, but with this album, the band is "moving in a new direction" and people are just supposed to accept that and get over it.


:thumbsup Nailed it.

[GLR87]

hunger for the great light is one of the most "non-dmb" song on the album only to second to odh...

[haildmb]

Old Dirt Hill is awful, in my opinion.

[JimiJam78]

The hypocrisy is really unbearable. It's perfectly alright to hate ED, but with this album, the band is "moving in a new direction" and people are just supposed to accept that and get over it.

if thats whats going on here then thats really quite sad. maybe i'm not on the boards enough to see it...but i hope thats not the case. i can only speak for myself, i'm an older fan and i genuinely like this album. i hope everyone else who claims to like stand up is being honest. i like to think dmb fans are character fans who can openly discuss and criticize music.... they aren't just sheep are they?

[Rippy]

if thats whats going on here then thats really quite sad. maybe i'm not on the boards enough to see it...but i hope thats not the case. i can only speak for myself, i'm an older fan and i genuinely like this album. i hope everyone else who claims to like stand up is being honest. i like to think dmb fans are character fans who can openly discuss and criticize music.... not just sheep.


That would be nice. Sadly, for a lot of people, anything "dave" puts out is music straight from God himself.

[Gex714]

I'm not an old school fan or a new school fan (I started listening between BTCS and Everyday). I'm not an expert on music, nor do I pretend to know anything about what is technically good or not good.

All I know is that I love driving down the road with the windows and sunroof open in the summer blasting Ants Marching, Lie in Our Graves, The Stone, etc...and from listening to the new songs, I'm gonna love doing the same with this album.

It makes me move and I enjoy it. That's all that matters to me. I can respect the opinion of those who do n't like it, but sometimes I wonder if people don't read into things too much. Then again, like I said, I don't know anything about mixing levels or production. All I know is that I like the sound, and that's enough for me.

[JimiJam78]

It makes me move and I enjoy it. That's all that matters to me. I can respect the opinion of those who do n't like it, but sometimes I wonder if people don't read into things too much. Then again, like I said, I don't know anything about mixing levels or production. All I know is that I like the sound, and that's enough for me.

couldn't have said it better myself.:thumbsup

[phishb13]

Exactly. Older fans feel like they have some "right" to gripe about a change because they know about DMB....irks me too.
i missed the part where he said that

[phishb13]

if thats whats going on here then thats really quite sad. maybe i'm not on the boards enough to see it...but i hope thats not the case. i can only speak for myself, i'm an older fan and i genuinely like this album. i hope everyone else who claims to like stand up is being honest. i like to think dmb fans are character fans who can openly discuss and criticize music.... they aren't just sheep are they?
it seems like a lot of people around here are getting shot down for having a negative opinion of the album...to the extent that people are losing their "flare" or whatever the hell it is they have around here

[ZildjianLudwig]

They probably will sound a lot better live,
I've said it before - when did we all resign ourselves to the fact that DMB Studio albums are "DMB-Lite?" There was a time when we didn't have to say "it will be better live" because it kicked ass in the studio as well.

I don't want a CD in my CD rack to be a "precursor to something better." If that's all it is, why am I spending money on IT rather than the "something better" that comes later?

The fact that these songs will kick ass live doesn't change the fact that they are mechanical right now, and that's how the band chose to present them to us. The band feels this is a final product worth our money. :BANG

[jay41]

I think it's an okay album. It's something new and fresh and different for the band, and I understand that it's important for them to branch out and try new things so that they don't grow stale.

Just because it's not on the same level as some of their older albums, and Dave's lyrics obviously aren't the best he's written, I'm not going to write off DMB just because of this album. Dave can still write and improv great lyrics, take a look at Some Devil (album) and the 5 summer songs from '04. Also look at the 5 summer songs from last year to see that DMB can still create music that isn't "pop" or "hip-hop" or "overproduced."

Some of these tracks on Stand Up have the potential to really shine in a live setting and to me that is what DMB is all about.

And to people attacking the original poster, he never said he was better or knew more because he was an older fan. He is entitled to his opinion and he made some really good points.

[mcw517]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares? I like Paul Simon but didn't see him until 2001, does that make me less of a fan? I don't think so. We all like what we like. Personally a lot of this album I dig quite a bit. Is it BTCS? Is it UTTAD? Is it Crash? No, it's Stand Up. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

I've been seeing DMB since before their last Roseland shows and I don't plan on disassociating myself with them, quite the contrary actually. I'm psyched for Roseland, Hartford, SPAC, and whatever else I can swing this summer. For all of you old fans who are writing off DMB please do some of my 'newer' fan friends a favor and cancel your WH accounts so those new fans can get the chance to sit up close and see DMB.

Couldn't have said it better. I'll admit, I've only been a fan for a little over a year. I'm fourteen. But I love DMB and I love their music,and that doesn't make me, or any newer fan out there, less of a fan. I'm going to my first ever DMB show this summer (although by listening to the live albums I've pictured myself there) and I am so excited.

Regardless of whether this album is as good as BTCS (which isn't even my favorite studio album) or not, the fact remains this is DMB. They have been playing for so long, and their music, like everything else, is constantly changing. Everyday, IMO, was the beggining of this change and it's pretty safe to say that was sort of an "experiment," it didn't come out the way anyone expected. Stand Up is also different. Not like Everyday, but very different. I think we all have to face that the band has changed. I don't think they changed become more "mainstream" because if it is one thing we know about DMB we know they love music and playing it. So basically, I guess what I'm trying to say, is embrace the music and live the music. You can't change the way the album was made by complaining, wait till you actually own it and hear the songs live before you put in your final judgement. Yes, DMB took another turn, but it's not the end of the road.

Ok, rant over.

[haildmb]

Yes, DMB took another turn, but it's not the end of the road.

Ok, rant over.


True. All it means is now I have to wait another 3+ yrs for another opportunity to hear brilliance from them.

And in 3+ yrs when their new album comes out, I'll be there to listen to it yet again. I am however one or two more full listens away from writing this album off.

[MoBb]

Only thing I can say..It will be harder to defend the band after this album. I know, it`s sad that I try to defend them, but I can`t help it..I hope they can make some magic with these songs live.

[clifflange]

I too am an "old" fan, I've seen over 50+ shows, have over 500 shows and feel that I have a fairly good frame of reference to form an opinion from. There is no question that this is not the same DMB as 10 years ago, good or bad, your choice. The bottom line is that I will continue to support them, listen to their old music, laugh at the young girls that sit in front of me at the concerts and only know the words to Crash, and be happy that the band came into this world. They have often times made me the happiest person alive and for that I'm thankful. In my "old" opinion, that's what lifes all about, that's what Dave's all about, and that's what all of you are about. Except for maybe the Eminem lover, he's just an ass. Enjoy!!!!

[DMBartender9]

Uh, a lot of you seemingly forget that not ALL change is good.

First of all, the LYRICS. Dave Matthews cannot write his aphoristically poetic lines no longer, it seems. That "China..." line in Dream Girl basically sums up this point with the rest of the album following in tow.

I enjoy DMB. I find them to be fun, eclectic, and exciting; however, this does not exclude me from objecting to their present trends.

I don't know how ANYONE can argue the overproduction value. Batson left his fingerprints everywhere, perhaps moreso than Ballard.

Stand Up is catchy, grooving, and fun, but it is not the same catchy grooving fun that is to be had on any of their previous albums. This is an altogether new DMB. It is Old World versus New World and not everyone cares for DMB new world style.

I don't particularly care what this band puts out; as someone said before, this is their band and they do what they want. I used to expect Shakespearean lines from Dave, as he had demonstrated so eloquently in the past, but it seems that he's traded his feather-tipped pen in for a 4th grader's sharpie.

The music, instrument oriented, is fun. But the lyrics are gone and never coming back.

Enjoy it for what it is: a 2005 album created by a band that can assume the title of Prince, "The Artist Formerly Known as The Dave Matthews Band."

[Lcsulla]

I'm going to my first ever DMB show this summer (although by listening to the live albums I've pictured myself there) and I am so excited.


Hope you have a wonderful time. I wish I could go back to early 1995 and relive my first show... if you can believe this I only went because a girl I liked wanted me to go. Basically I got dragged there... kind of snowballed into the next 60 shows or so. Anyhow, you'll love it and I hope you hear a great set :)

Cheers ~ Jamie

[hills205]

I too am an "old" fan, I've seen over 50+ shows, have over 500 shows and feel that I have a fairly good frame of reference to form an opinion from. There is no question that this is not the same DMB as 10 years ago, good or bad, your choice. The bottom line is that I will continue to support them, listen to their old music, laugh at the young girls that sit in front of me at the concerts and only know the words to Crash, and be happy that the band came into this world. They have often times made me the happiest person alive and for that I'm thankful. In my "old" opinion, that's what lifes all about, that's what Dave's all about, and that's what all of you are about. Except for maybe the Eminem lover, he's just an ass. Enjoy!!!!

:thumbsup i enjoyed your post and i agree with you. (except im not quite an "old" fan)

im looking forward to the summer concerts and imo, some of the songs from SU will be really fun to hear live.

[JimiJam78]

it seems like a lot of people around here are getting shot down for having a negative opinion of the album...to the extent that people are losing their "flare" or whatever the hell it is they have around here

yeah well i'm not sure what to think of this "flare" thing they got going on here. but overall this place has a little competitive edge to it with people trying to out "fan" each other. like "flare" and # of posts mean something?? anyway, enough board bashing. its nice here, i've seen a lot worse as far as boards go.

[stoneje]

DMB has been my favorite band ever since BTCS came out in 1998. I'm not one of the older fans here, but I do have the same love for all their music as an older fan does, and I'd have to say, this album is great. Not even comparable to ED. But I have to admit, I don't think its comparable to BTCS.


I was hoping to see some more moderate comments like this: it seems like a fair number of people posting aren't really putting their first listen in the proper context. If you love it and think it is the single greatest thing you've heard, ever... well, chances are you probably won't always feel that way forever. On the other hand, if listening to these songs made you want to hurl, try to remember that this is only your FIRST try at something different - I can't imagine what would have happened if Paul Simon's fans deserted him when he went from Garfunkel to Graceland, or if Bob Dylan's following decided they really didn't like his 31st and 32nd albums and so they were going give up on him and never come back. If this turns out to be a 'forgettable' album, then that's still okay - DMB wouldn't be the first band in history to miss the mark on a few of their releases. Are we really at the sticker-peeling point already? Greenday fans probably compare everything else to Dookie, and Celine Dion fans probably hold every new release up to whatever awful cd that Titanic song was released on, but they still find new things to appreciate about their favorite artists each time... even if it takes a while. So yeah, in conclusion, whether or not you like the album now, you've only just heard it today. Try it tomorrow. Or try it this summer. But let's not be jumping off any cliffs just yet!

Okay, sorry, I'll let you guys get back to your thing and I'll head back over to Trading Central where I belong:)

[Dogger3614]

Everybody is getting too worked up over the "older fan"/"newer fan" concept. I would fall into the "older fan" stereotype since I have been seeing the band since 1994. However, I am only 25 years old so does that also qualify me for the "older fan" or "newer fan" range? I think the main problem here is that people who have been listening and going to shows longer than other people have a different point of view when it comes to DMB. I would never say I am a bigger fan than someone else just cause I happen to have heard/seen the band before they had. However, I find the new album to be a bit of a disappointment because I heard and saw the progression of the band from 1994-2000 and was in total awe. Every DMB fan I knew felt that the band was on the verge of becoming one of the world's most inspirational and influential bands (they had conquered North America by the end of 2000). However, DMB decided to head in a new direction right when they were on the brink of all-time musical greatness. It's their band and their choice so I respected their decision. I still go to their concerts and dance my ass off and will continue to for as long as they tour.

However, in the end I think most fans who watched the development of the bad from 1994-2000 still have a feeling that the band has some unfinished business., I know I think they do. Hopefully, one day I will see the band finish what I and many others thought they had set out to do in their early years. Till then I listen to any pop/r&b/rap album they put out and see where they can take the new songs. Hope to see everyone at SPAC and other stops along the way this summer!

P.S. I am still a total believer in this band's greatness and I will wait for however long it will take for the boys to come full circle and finish the business they started during those first 10 years.

[nonewdirections]

This is funny. Old fans... new fans.. who cares? I like Paul Simon but didn't see him until 2001, does that make me less of a fan? I don't think so. We all like what we like. Personally a lot of this album I dig quite a bit. Is it BTCS? Is it UTTAD? Is it Crash? No, it's Stand Up. Take it or leave it, it's your choice.

I've been seeing DMB since before their last Roseland shows and I don't plan on disassociating myself with them, quite the contrary actually. I'm psyched for Roseland, Hartford, SPAC, and whatever else I can swing this summer. For all of you old fans who are writing off DMB please do some of my 'newer' fan friends a favor and cancel your WH accounts so those new fans can get the chance to sit up close and see DMB.

this is a fantastic post. i'm not even sure if i like this album, or even if i'm going to buy it, but this was well said and is what it's all about.