Will we get HD audio released?

[mbrennan5]

It seems like Red Light is willing to try new things (DualDisc for SU, vinyl for BW). It's really about time we had some HD audio, be it a bonus disc with just audio in 2.0 or 5.1.

[canyonfool]

We did get the 5.1 DVD Bartender with Busted Stuff, too.

[blusi]

What is HD audio? Is it SACD? I want vinyl again...

[bigkosmo22]

What, exactly, are you calling HD audio?

HD is not a term you can use to refer to audio, and if you do, it tells someone who knows wtf they are talking about that you do NOT know what you are talking about.

[Dannyyankou]

Here's something new.
http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/28/apple-reportedly-developing-high-definition-audio-format-with-adaptive-streaming/

[Jordan#41]

It seems like Red Light is willing to try new things (DualDisc for SU, vinyl for BW). It's really about time we had some HD audio, be it a bonus disc with just audio in 2.0 or 5.1.

That Stand Up dual disc was a mess. I could never figure out how to properly import it into my iTunes library.

[dobyblue]

We were supposed to get high resolution audio with Stand Up, it was originally listed as having a 2.0 24/48 track which then turned into "Enhanced Stereo" 16/48, a bit of a joke.

The 5.1 Bartender is lossy 448 Kbps Dolby. It's a nice presentation of the song, but fidelity wise it's not much better than a low bitrate .mp3 file.

The only high resolution would be 24-bit downloads or Blu-ray. Given that you still can't get a DMB show on Blu-ray it's highly unlikely you'll see it used as an audio format, Dave doesn't understand the concept of fidelity like Tom Petty and Neil Young do.

Vinyl is definitely not new. So I'd say you're going to get CD, digital downloads not exceeding CD quality and vinyl. Hopefully the vinyl will be spread over 4 sides like Big Whiskey was, no more than 20 minutes a side.

You can also vote on what formats you'd LIKE to see the new album released on here - http://antsmarching.org/forum/showthread.php?t=306895

Good to see people interested in it though. Personally I'd love to see a 24/96 5.1 track on Blu-ray. While I love SACD and DVD-Audio, I don't think you're reaching the same markets that way. All Blu-ray players support 24/192 5.1 and 24/96 7.1 high resolution PCM.

[mbrennan5]

I could go either way, giving us a standard resolution 5.1 release would be better than nothing, and I really enjoyed the Bartender from what I remember. I'd really prefer to pay a bunch extra for a CD/Blu-Ray with 24/96 2.0 and any 5.1.

I agree the best we're likely to be offered is what BW had. Hold out hope for decent mastering?

[dobyblue]

I'm holding out hope...but if I had to bet money I'd bet on a poorly mastered CD.

I would buy a bottle of Dom to celebrate the release of the new album if it's Blu-ray 5.1, hahaha.

[jaymas9]

What, exactly, are you calling HD audio?

HD is not a term you can use to refer to audio, and if you do, it tells someone who knows wtf they are talking about that you do NOT know what you are talking about.Seriously? My head actually hurts with the amount completely wrong in this post. Which wouldn't be so bad if you weren't coming off like a snarky child. And lastly, doby is without a doubt one of the more educated audiophiles on here. Sit back and you may learn something.

[jaymas9]

We were supposed to get high resolution audio with Stand Up, it was originally listed as having a 2.0 24/48 track which then turned into "Enhanced Stereo" 16/48, a bit of a joke.

The 5.1 Bartender is lossy 448 Kbps Dolby. It's a nice presentation of the song, but fidelity wise it's not much better than a low bitrate .mp3 file.

The only high resolution would be 24-bit downloads or Blu-ray. Given that you still can't get a DMB show on Blu-ray it's highly unlikely you'll see it used as an audio format, Dave doesn't understand the concept of fidelity like Tom Petty and Neil Young do.

Vinyl is definitely not new. So I'd say you're going to get CD, digital downloads not exceeding CD quality and vinyl. Hopefully the vinyl will be spread over 4 sides like Big Whiskey was, no more than 20 minutes a side.

You can also vote on what formats you'd LIKE to see the new album released on here - http://antsmarching.org/forum/showthread.php?t=306895

Good to see people interested in it though. Personally I'd love to see a 24/96 5.1 track on Blu-ray. While I love SACD and DVD-Audio, I don't think you're reaching the same markets that way. All Blu-ray players support 24/192 5.1 and 24/96 7.1 high resolution PCM.This I would love, simply because it's where I have the equipment to support enjoying it.

[Mateo2k]

Dave doesn't understand the concept of fidelity like Tom Petty and Neil Young do.


This is a bold claim.

Perhaps he understands it, but doesn't give a fuck, like 99% of the population.

[SpotlightEyes]

Given that you still can't get a DMB show on Blu-ray it's highly unlikely you'll see it used as an audio format, Dave doesn't understand the concept of fidelity like Tom Petty and Neil Young do.

This is what I thought too when reading the thread title.

[SpotlightEyes]

This is a bold claim.

Perhaps he understands it, but doesn't give a fuck, like 99% of the population.

:lol Like anyone should care what the "population" finds good. The population would find slavery acceptable, if "everyone did it" and it was "free"

[dobyblue]

This is a bold claim.

Perhaps he understands it, but doesn't give a fuck, like 99% of the population.

Perhaps, but 99% unlikely.

[SpecialAgent007]

I think in due time it'll get an HD release as there's a very high likelihood that iTunes will be transitioning to HD audio downloads in the near future. Now that storage space and bandwidth are becoming less of an issue (we can stream HD video with relative ease in many cases) and streaming is becoming more and more standardized, I fully expect Apple to begin offering 24/96 Apple Lossless files as well as adaptive streaming technology for it's newer iTunes Match service that will stream the highest quality content to your mobile devices or Apple TV based on your network connection.

Besides the obvious that it's simply good timing technologically to progress in the audio arena, there have been a number of rumors floated around by industry folks and reputable news outlets that tend to receive controlled leaks from Apple. Neil Young recently spoke of working with Apple on a new high end music format. Other label executives have mentioned that Apple has been in talks with them to allow HD downloads. Also, more recently even, Apple has requested that all music submitted to the iTunes store be encoded at 24/96 in order to allow for the highest quality audio for future uses.

Similarly, late last fall it was rumored that Apple was working with studios on allowing 1080P video downloads from the iTunes Store, and now less than six months later, with the announcement of the new 1080P-capable Apple TV, Apple also announced that 1080P downloads were now available within the store on new and previous purchases as well as rentals. I'm expecting an announcement this summer when they release the new Mac OS, which will inevitably lead to a new version of iTunes, though a summer iTunes update could be incremental. I also wouldn't be shocked then to see it this fall when the new iPhone and iPods launch. I think it all depends on when they decide to launch the reworked iTunes and iTunes Store which is in the pipeline, and that will undoubtedly happen alongside either Mac OS 10.8 or with the launch of the new iPhone.

So the good news is that it's very likely that the entire DMB catalog will be available in HD on iTunes before the end of the year.

[SpecialAgent007]

We were supposed to get high resolution audio with Stand Up, it was originally listed as having a 2.0 24/48 track which then turned into "Enhanced Stereo" 16/48, a bit of a joke.

The 5.1 Bartender is lossy 448 Kbps Dolby. It's a nice presentation of the song, but fidelity wise it's not much better than a low bitrate .mp3 file.

The only high resolution would be 24-bit downloads or Blu-ray. Given that you still can't get a DMB show on Blu-ray it's highly unlikely you'll see it used as an audio format, Dave doesn't understand the concept of fidelity like Tom Petty and Neil Young do.

Vinyl is definitely not new. So I'd say you're going to get CD, digital downloads not exceeding CD quality and vinyl. Hopefully the vinyl will be spread over 4 sides like Big Whiskey was, no more than 20 minutes a side.

You can also vote on what formats you'd LIKE to see the new album released on here - http://antsmarching.org/forum/showthread.php?t=306895

Good to see people interested in it though. Personally I'd love to see a 24/96 5.1 track on Blu-ray. While I love SACD and DVD-Audio, I don't think you're reaching the same markets that way. All Blu-ray players support 24/192 5.1 and 24/96 7.1 high resolution PCM.

I'm pretty much over 5.1 music. When they get HD 2.0 music right, I might care about 5.1 again. But now, I'd just love readily available HD 2.0 audio downloads. But hey, I'd love it if they just learned to mix and master in general without killing dynamics and resorting to excessive, gimmicky panning.

[bustedstuff88]

I think in due time it'll get an HD release as there's a very high likelihood that iTunes will be transitioning to HD audio downloads in the near future. Now that storage space and bandwidth are becoming less of an issue (we can stream HD video with relative ease in many cases) and streaming is becoming more and more standardized, I fully expect Apple to begin offering 24/96 Apple Lossless files as well as adaptive streaming technology for it's newer iTunes Match service that will stream the highest quality content to your mobile devices or Apple TV based on your network connection.

Besides the obvious that it's simply good timing technologically to progress in the audio arena, there have been a number of rumors floated around by industry folks and reputable news outlets that tend to receive controlled leaks from Apple. Neil Young recently spoke of working with Apple on a new high end music format. Other label executives have mentioned that Apple has been in talks with them to allow HD downloads. Also, more recently even, Apple has requested that all music submitted to the iTunes store be encoded at 24/96 in order to allow for the highest quality audio for future uses.

Similarly, late last fall it was rumored that Apple was working with studios on allowing 1080P video downloads from the iTunes Store, and now less than six months later, with the announcement of the new 1080P-capable Apple TV, Apple also announced that 1080P downloads were now available within the store on new and previous purchases as well as rentals. I'm expecting an announcement this summer when they release the new Mac OS, which will inevitably lead to a new version of iTunes, though a summer iTunes update could be incremental. I also wouldn't be shocked then to see it this fall when the new iPhone and iPods launch. I think it all depends on when they decide to launch the reworked iTunes and iTunes Store which is in the pipeline, and that will undoubtedly happen alongside either Mac OS 10.8 or with the launch of the new iPhone.

So the good news is that it's very likely that the entire DMB catalog will be available in HD on iTunes before the end of the year.

All this so the masses can listen to high quality audio files only mucked up by shitty ear buds or cell phone speakers?

I have spent a few thousand dollars to get decent SQ out of the system in my car, but i think im in the minority that still care about fidelity enough to drop the dollars on quality equipment to reproduce it.

[mja271]

Don't particularly care. I'll pil up the vinyl though

[bigkosmo22]

Seriously? My head actually hurts with the amount completely wrong in this post. Which wouldn't be so bad if you weren't coming off like a snarky child. And lastly, doby is without a doubt one of the more educated audiophiles on here. Sit back and you may learn something.

Right, but even your sarcasm doesn't make "HD Audio" a real thing. Link anything you like in retort, however that standard simply does not exist.

[dobyblue]

I'm pretty much over 5.1 music. When they get HD 2.0 music right, I might care about 5.1 again. But now, I'd just love readily available HD 2.0 audio downloads. But hey, I'd love it if they just learned to mix and master in general without killing dynamics and resorting to excessive, gimmicky panning.

If you have the ability to listen to 5.1 you're doing yourself a real disservice by not picking up the new SACD release of Pink Floyd's "Wish You Were Here". Guthrie has DEFINITELY learned where his surround-mix weaknesses were from the 2003 5.1 SACD of Dark Side of the Moon and has clearly understood more what Alan Parsons was doing back in the 70's with the original Quad mix. It's a shame there isn't a standalone Blu-ray release as those without SACD playback have to fork over $100 (as low as $62 last week on Amazon though) for the Immersion set but bonus being Parson's Quad mixes finally mastered properly in 4.0 24/96 PCM. But with SACD equipment you can get the SACD standalone version featuring Guthrie's astonishing 5.1 mix for $35 - http://store.acousticsounds.com/d/77001/Pink_Floyd-Wish_You_Were_Here-Hybrid_Multichannel_SACD

Beautiful surround mix, not a single gimmicky pan in the entire thing. Worst panning I've ever heard? Tubular Bells 2003 DVD-Audio - shame because the fidelity and recording in 2.0 are terrific.

With the loudness wars it's true they're ruining a lot of music, but you'll find the 5.1 music is coming out on specialty labels that DO know what they're doing and don't fuck the music up with overzealous dynamic range compression. Of course lots of times there are only 2.0 versions, the recent SACD of Cat Stevens' Tea for the Tillerman is gorgeous done from Analog>DSD with no PCM conversion (vinyl done as well straight analogue) and the various Nat King Cole SACD's by Hoffman that range from Mono to 3.0 and some I think in 5.1

You know who is actually worse than Ted Jensen? That fucking idiot Vlado Meller. He did the most recent Chili Peppers album (and the three CD's before it) delivering a CD with an average of 3~4dB of DR. Asshole, can the guy hear at all? He fucked up the new Jane's Addiction CD, that one only has 5dB of dynamic range. God I would seriously punch him right in the face just so he understands how serious music is and how much he's fucking it up. The guy should have to wear a balaclava to pick up his paycheque.

It's nice to be surprised occasionally - I don't know if the CD was fucked up like most others but the vinyl of the Fleet Foxes first album is very nice indeed.

The HD downloads of Siamese Dream are good, pretty much the same DR as the original CD and lots of high frequency info so they did them properly.

[dobyblue]

Right, but even your sarcasm doesn't make "HD Audio" a real thing. Link anything you like in retort, however that standard simply does not exist.

I prefer "high resolution" but it does seem like HD has become more commonplace for anything higher than 16-bit/48kHz PCM.

https://www.hdtracks.com/

[jaymas9]

Right, but even your sarcasm doesn't make "HD Audio" a real thing. Link anything you like in retort, however that standard simply does not exist.Haha, you're splitting hairs...which really was my whole point. It is becoming a very commonplace term. I also prefer high resolution, but there's no arguing the term high definition is being used commonly right now when describing what we are talking about. I just thought it was absolutely silly for you to use that as a foundation to tell someone who clearly knows what they are talking about...that they don't.

[stoneje]

This would be the perfect time for someone to post "HD Audio sounds dope on my Beats!". Pretty sure heads would explode.

But to actually add something to the thread, no, we're not going to get an HD audio release. The target market is way too small.

[dobyblue]

My HD .mp3's sound killer on my Bose system, I get the best money can buy.

[bigkosmo22]

Haha, you're splitting hairs...which really was my whole point. It is becoming a very commonplace term. I also prefer high resolution, but there's no arguing the term high definition is being used commonly right now when describing what we are talking about. I just thought it was absolutely silly for you to use that as a foundation to tell someone who clearly knows what they are talking about...that they don't.

This nearly my exact point. To what actual standard does HD adhere to? What format is it? Bitrate? Etc...

Slapping HD in front of your product is nearly as commonplace a marketing tactic as 3D. Next, someone will post an example of a 3D audio track.

[dobyblue]

Seems for most places that now deal in downloads, HD refers to anything that is 24-bit resolution with a sampling rate of 44.1kHz or higher, usually 48kHz or 96kHz.

But the problem is if the lineage isn't noted, how do you know what the source was? Brothers In Arms DualDisc (the better version of the two high resolution releases but several times more expensive now than the SACD) was created from 16/44.1 source files as that is how it was recorded (one of the first if not the first DDD recordings). It's the surround track that rocks, but it will always be limited by the source material for fidelity unless it's re-recorded.

Thankfully John Frusciante insisted on recording Stadium Arcadium concurrently to analog, so when Hoffman did the vinyl it was an all analog chain with wonderful dynamics, a huge difference from the disgusting mess of a CD Vlado Meller mastered.

The Rush Blu-ray of Moving Pictures has a 24/96 5.1 mix done from the original analog multi-track tapes but the 2.0 24/96 track was mastered from a 16/44.1 master - so if you don't want the surround mix, don't buy the album.

Hoffman's Nat King Cole SACD's were done all analog from the original tapes (vinyl was all analog) then converted to DSD with no PCM conversion.

All about the lineage, all about the mastering. I'll take a well-mastered CD any day over a dynamically lifeless 24-bit/96kHz track. The original Geffen CD release of Nirvana's Nevermind sounds better than the new 24/96 download in my opinion, much more dynamic.