***Official Premiership, FA Cup, Carling Cup, Champions League etc. Thread***

[mrignatious]

Originally Posted by whodat

Solid info and assessment. It is very clear that the back 4 and central midfield for Madrid are a large reason for their recent success. However, a team needs a finisher in the right areas or the people delivering the ball are just wasting their efforts. You can look at any team that was dominate over large stretches that it was never just about the strikers or scorers. A common thread is always that central part of the pitch in your own half, moving the ball up the field and getting that delivery into the box for their goal scores to have a chance.

As you have noted with the powerhouse that Madrid has built, do you think Madrid have the same level of success without Ronaldo? Would Benzema, Bale, James or any other scorer be able to pick up the 30-40 goals per season that Ronaldo provides, in some way, shape or form? The same argument could have been made 5-6 years ago when Messi was running wild. They are both incredible talents, and they are not simply replaced. Just looking the value of the player to their team in trying to weigh the argument of each players overall impact on the game.

That's exactly my point. Their success with their club teams, or more accurately their dominant run of winning trophies with their club teams, have been a result of their teams being dominant rather than a run of individual brilliance.

It's silly to say that either team would be *as* successful without Messi/Ronaldo, clearly they've been the two best players in the world for nearly a decade. But I do think that Madrid could have snagged the league and or the CL with Benzema/Morata as their primary goal scorers. The rest of the team is just that good.

[aeroshady]

Originally Posted by mrignatious

That's exactly my point. Their success with their club teams, or more accurately their dominant run of winning trophies with their club teams, have been a result of their teams being dominant rather than a run of individual brilliance.

It's silly to say that either team would be *as* successful without Messi/Ronaldo, clearly they've been the two best players in the world for nearly a decade. But I do think that Madrid could have snagged the league and or the CL with Benzema/Morata as their primary goal scorers. The rest of the team is just that good.

I would argue that Barca would have or could have won a CL without Messi though as well.

My biggest issue with the entire argument is always people thinking there is a correct answer. There is not. It is all personal preference which is kind of the point I was going for when I originally said Neuer was my favorite. Strong arguments can be made that both Bayern and Germany would have been less successful with out him between the posts.

[whodat]

Originally Posted by aeroshady

I would argue that Barca would have or could have won a CL without Messi though as well.

My biggest issue with the entire argument is always people thinking there is a correct answer. There is not. It is all personal preference which is kind of the point I was going for when I originally said Neuer was my favorite. Strong arguments can be made that both Bayern and Germany would have been less successful with out him between the posts.

What is tough about adding keepers to the conversation, is that rarely are they given the credit for winning cups or tournaments, unless of course PKs are involved. Yet, they are quick to take the blame when their team flames out at any point, especially if PKs involved.

[panini2001]

On the point of keepers its looking increasingly like Joe Hart is losing his England no.1 tag (not that I ever thought he was anyway) and a certain Stoke City keeper is about to enter the arena. Fixtures tomorrow everyone for the PL.

[42graystreet]

Originally Posted by panini2001

On the point of keepers its looking increasingly like Joe Hart is losing his England no.1 tag (not that I ever thought he was anyway) and a certain Stoke City keeper is about to enter the arena. Fixtures tomorrow everyone for the PL.

It's about time. I need to plan out my fall. The Minnesota (American Football) Vikings are playing in London in October...

[42graystreet]

Oh. And Ronaldo is totes better than Messi. Don't even @ me, guys.

Apparently neither Ronaldo or Messi pay taxes ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[aeroshady]

Originally Posted by 42graystreet

Oh. And Ronaldo is totes better than Messi. Don't even @ me, guys.

Apparently neither Ronaldo or Messi pay taxes ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

That is exactly what I thought when I read that today. I will gladly sign up to do their taxes for them every year for a small fee of $1mil/year. Seems a small price to pay to avoid the hassle they are going through now.

[DaveHead36]

6 charged in the Hillsborough disaster today. Only took 30 years. Justice for the 96!

[Ascf33]

[whodat]

Summer transfer window is now fully open. Time to see who can start closing deals as summer tours start and the EPL seasons kicks off in just 6 short weeks.

[whodat]

Great Confed Cup final. 10 min to go.

[whodat]

Far from a done deal, but looks like Lukaku will end up at ManU. I would be a happy ManU fan if this went through.

[dre2142]

Lacazette to Arsenal sounds good.

Now just to keep sanchez.....

[42graystreet]

Chelsea are screwing up this transfer window. With Jose taking Lukaku (who I was never that high on), we need to keep Costa and sign Morata or Belloti. But no, Costa is going and no word on Morata.

[whodat]

Seems like Real are holding out on Morata, nothing lower then their valuation to even start the conversation.

[YouNeverKnow25]

that brazilian third-leaguer sure seemed to have his hands full

[mrignatious]

Originally Posted by YouNeverKnow25

that brazilian third-leaguer sure seemed to have his hands full

[whodat]

What in the hell is world coming to if PSG actually put in the bid of €222m to release Neymar from his contract with Barca and make the move?! That would more then double with ManU paid for Pogba just a year ago. What ever happened to FFP?

[42graystreet]

Doubt that'll happen. But I'd be curious to see the ramifications if it did.

For the first time in 13 years, Chelsea is being looked at as a club trying to operate under a reasonable budget. "Reasonable" for a big club. Chelsea fans are not happy with our lack of movement in the transfer market. One impactful signing so far.

[whodat]

Chelsea have been very Arsenal-esque in their transfer window deals. Same goes for Spurs and Liverpool. Very curious to see how Spurs and Liverpool adjust to CL games this season if they don't add to their squads. Liverpool only had top-4 to play for from the end of January last season, having been dropped from both domestic cups. And Spurs, like Chelsea, only had FA Cups games added to their fixture list after the new year, having been eliminated from all other cup competitions. If either of those teams expect to still compete for top-4, along with UCL, they better figure some shit out quick.

[whodat]

Originally Posted by 42graystreet

Doubt that'll happen. But I'd be curious to see the ramifications if it did.

For the first time in 13 years, Chelsea is being looked at as a club trying to operate under a reasonable budget. "Reasonable" for a big club. Chelsea fans are not happy with our lack of movement in the transfer market. One impactful signing so far.

Make that two, or three, impactful signings, depending on how you look at it. Conte improves his remaining two years on his deal, then the club announce a deal with Morata.

[Lcsulla]

Originally Posted by whodat

What is tough about adding keepers to the conversation, is that rarely are they given the credit for winning cups or tournaments, unless of course PKs are involved. Yet, they are quick to take the blame when their team flames out at any point, especially if PKs involved.

Some goal keepers could literally push a team from good to exceptional. The best example I can think of was how dominant Oliver Khan was in his prime. Dude was just amazing to watch.

[42graystreet]

Morata! Woo!!! That's a big one with Costa out the door. Would like a center back and then I'd be satisfied.

[dre2142]

was awesome watching barca vs man u. they really are something special.

[Ascf33]

we doing fantasy again this year?

[clayj41]

Originally Posted by Ascf33

we doing fantasy again this year?

I'm not. Think I started the league last year, set an initial lineup, and then never checked it again.

[DaveHead36]

Yeah I think I kept up for a couple weeks then forgot about, I don't wanna be "that guy" again

[Ascf33]

As evidenced by me starting Mane every single week last year, I'd probably agree.

[whodat]

Nice to see ManU finally nailed down the Matic transfer, adding the solid, holding midfield that was really lacking behind Carrick last season. Adding a wing back would be nice and finalizing left back too.

[whodat]

Originally Posted by 42graystreet

Doubt that'll happen. But I'd be curious to see the ramifications if it did.

For the first time in 13 years, Chelsea is being looked at as a club trying to operate under a reasonable budget. "Reasonable" for a big club. Chelsea fans are not happy with our lack of movement in the transfer market. One impactful signing so far.

Looks like Neymar to PSG is about to happen and we will find out about any FFP ramifications over time. This move is so weird. Sounds like to me that Neymar wants to step out of the shadow of Messi, and to a certain point Ronaldo, and be the guy on a team. While he may do well domestically, unless PSG can really build around him, I don't see an immediate impact, or any impact at all, in the UCL with this move.