Aaron Sorkin HBO show The Newsroom

[RJP2741]

Really excellent pilot, hopefully the drop off isn't as bad as the critics seem to be implying.

[TrippingBilly95]

Thought the pilot was fantastic. The opening was so intriguing and well done. And the tie back to the beginning from the end was great too. Highly anticipating upcoming eps.

[joshizzle3]

Originally Posted by RJP2741

Really excellent pilot, hopefully the drop off isn't as bad as the critics seem to be implying.

I didn't know they let people like you on am.org

[RJP2741]

Oh, I'm here, just took a little break from posting and took my avatar down. I've been lurking.

[Trippin4136]

Just watched it.

It was good, but holy fuck, the preachiness of the characters. Does there need to be a soliloquy every five minutes?

And based on the reviews, that was the problem. Hopefully that doesn't get worse.

The "action" scenes of discovering the story was good. The back and forth "this is why journalism sucks now and why it and the U.S. can be better!" was eye-rolling.

[Beebz]

Originally Posted by Trippin4136

Just watched it.

It was good, but holy fuck, the preachiness of the characters. Does there need to be a soliloquy every five minutes?

And based on the reviews, that was the problem. Hopefully that doesn't get worse.

The "action" scenes of discovering the story was good. The back and forth "this is why journalism sucks now and why it and the U.S. can be better!" was eye-rolling.

I dont get this criticism. This is who Sorkin is. We all loved this in the West Wing. He does the same thing with the news profession and all of a sudden its overbearing. Makes no sense to me.

[Trippin4136]

Originally Posted by Beebz

I dont get this criticism. This is who Sorkin is. We all loved this in the West Wing. He does the same thing with the news profession and all of a sudden its overbearing. Makes no sense to me.

Yes, I loved the West Wing too.

Difference here, writing is worse, Sorkin's preaching is more in your face, actors are not as good.

[Beebz]

Originally Posted by Trippin4136

Yes, I loved the West Wing too.

Difference here, writing is worse, Sorkin's preaching is more in your face, actors are not as good.

I dont think any of that is true. Maybe the white house setting made the preachiness more organic, but it was no different. Hell, the very first episode of the West Wing concludes with the liberal brainiac president of the United States disemboweling a cliche spewing cookie-cutter Bible thumper. Thats about as in your face as it gets.

Sorkin gonna Sorkin. West Wing, Sports Night, Studio 60 and now Newsroom. They all share signature Sorkin dramatics, smugness and elitism. And its usually pretty awesome.

[Trippin4136]

Ok, that's your opinion.

I thought this was overly contrived, and the interview with Sorkin following the episode only confirmed that for me.

Just because you appear to think Sorkin is some screenwriting god, doesn't mean everything coming off his pen was gold.

The pilot had good moments, but IMO it also had some really shitty parts to it.

[cruscott35]

I didn't get the preachiness everyone is talking about, and I was looking for it and was probably in line to be 'offended' by it.

[Beebz]

Originally Posted by Trippin4136

Ok, that's your opinion.

I thought this was overly contrived, and the interview with Sorkin following the episode only confirmed that for me.

Just because you appear to think Sorkin is some screenwriting god, doesn't mean everything coming off his pen was gold.

The pilot had good moments, but IMO it also had some really shitty parts to it.

I dont think hes a screenwriting god or infallible. But the complaints everyone is leveling at Newsroom are the exact same things people love about West Wing. This feels like classic Internet gang pack mentality - Popular Thing Gets Destroyed Because Internet.

Just rewatched the Sports Night pilot. The laugh track (which Sorkin fought against and lost) is abysmal and there's a lot of high-minded cheese that isnt really earned yet. But its still decent.

[dmbmuskie]

Finally, watched this. Definitely one of the best pilots I've ever seen along with Mad Men and the Sopranos. Cannot wait for the next one.

[junior94]

I'm not sure if there's enough time removed from this yet to give an honest opinion, but I'm wondering for your fellow hardcore Sorkin fans out there, how do you rank his pilot episodes? (being of course Sports Night, The West Wing, Studio 60, and now The Newsroom)

I'm talking about purely the strength of the pilot episode in each case.

[junior94]

Originally Posted by dre2142

tsk tsk tsk.....

A supercut of Aaron Sorkin recycled dialogue. Its not even that he does it...its the amount of times he has done it. (7 minutes worth!)

http://www.buzzfeed.com/bfeld/a-supe...orkin-dialogue

I have to admit, one of my favorite little bit of Sorkin-isms that I rarely ever heard before watching his stuff (if ever at all) that I now use frequently in my own daily speech is, to convey incredulity at something, I love saying "and for reasons passing understanding..."

[junior94]

Originally Posted by Beebz

Was that Eisenberg as the MMS voice?

Leave it to me to be the 3-poster-in-a-row dork, but figured I'd follow up on this for you beebz if you hadn't heard yourself yet. Yes, according to IMDB. Jesse Eisenberg is indeed the (uncredited) voice of the MMS guy on the phone call.

[dre2142]

Originally Posted by dmbmuskie

Finally, watched this. Definitely one of the best pilots I've ever seen along with Mad Men and the Sopranos. Cannot wait for the next one.

WOW.

If some of it wasnt so far fetched I would have liked it a lot more.

[smokew11]

i thought it was excellant...yeah the speeches were a bit much but it wasnt too bad. I think the EP's monlogues to Will were meant to be campy.

[newscane]

Originally Posted by junior94

I'm not sure if there's enough time removed from this yet to give an honest opinion, but I'm wondering for your fellow hardcore Sorkin fans out there, how do you rank his pilot episodes? (being of course Sports Night, The West Wing, Studio 60, and now The Newsroom)

I'm talking about purely the strength of the pilot episode in each case.

S60's opening monologue was tough to beat. Newsroom's may have eclipsed it, but that may only be because of the fact it was on HBO...

I liked how the opening of TWW introduced you to all of the characters, and the episode gave you a couple of storylines to follow. It's also worth noting that in the pilot, Jed Bartlet was still intended as a "once in a while" character.. so he gets brought in at the end to bring things all together -- which really worked.

Sports Night is tough to compare to the others, as a 30-minute dramedy, versus hour-plus shows. Jeremy Goodwin's (Josh Malina) interview is pretty priceless though

On the other hand, with Newsroom's pilot running much longer, and not being interrupted by commercials, it allows for a lot more development than the others did...

[DrewD55]

Finally watched this on my flight from my old home (Buffalo) to my current one in Miami this morning. There's a lot of good to be said about the pilot, which features enough of Sorkin's crackling dialogue to be engaging at all times, but the speeches, save for the first one by Daniels at the Northwestern media thing-y (which I wish someone would actually say--closet I can think of is Jon Stewart ripping the fuck out of the guys on the long-since-cancelled "Crossfire" on CNN), are excessively earnest, as if the idealized speeches of The West Wing suddenly lost all sense of the real world.

I liked the buzz and frenetic energy of producing a live news show (something that The West Wing never really got credit for in its depiction of how fast the political scene moves, but also excelled at), but I can already see the problems seeping in. First and foremost, Daniels' character is an asshole, and even what I'm sure Sorkin intends, or sees, as his redeeming qualities (I'm going to ask questions that matter, dammit!) are overwhelmed by what's long been a problem with the characters that serve as Sorkin's onscreen stand-in, which is that way too often, they're smug, condescending, sexist, and patronizingly insufferable know-it-alls. Only the most blindly die-hard fan could say that Josh Lyman didn't suffer from most of the same problems throughout TWW's run. There's a way to be right and not be a dick about it, and all too often, Sorkin mistakenly equates arrogance with his concept of roguish charm and sarcastic wit, or some such argle bargle.

This is leaving aside the issues of stretching credibility, which I know Sorkin is already on the record as not giving a shit about. Frankly, I'm cool with that. There's never been a modern White House administration so absurdly earnest as the folks working for Jed Bartlett, so I can go along with that. On the other hand, Sorkin's decision to examine real life events, like the Deep Water Horizon disaster in the Gulf, rather than, say, stopping ethnic genocide in a fictional African country, or any other device he used on TWW, strikes me as way too convenient. If there was one thing I liked about South Park's "The Coon Trilogy", it was the character "Captain Hindsight", which also took on the Gulf disaster. South Park makes my point for me, which is to say that, after the fact, anyone can write up three soliloquies on why what was done was wrong, never mind that it's being done 2 years after the fact.

The only way I can tolerate that is the one glancing quote that the EP character gave about "informing the stupid", or something like that. There are plenty of people in this country who have a lot of misguided opinions and beliefs about a lot of things. Some of them may be HBO subscribers and could probably use a little refresher course on one thing or another. That, and I do believe that there is a difference between journalists being biased and them asking tough questions that this country seems to have forgotten about. Trouble is, that Sorkin doesn't stop with the tough questions and continues to interject his own views after the tough questions have been asked, which misses the point entirely.

Love Sam Waterston's work (Jack McCoy, drunker and shoutier than ever, which for some strange reason, is awesome in my book), as well as a few others, but if I can see the cracks this early on (too much Sorkin over the years; his patterns tend not to change too much), I don't see this being terribly good 4-5 episodes down the road.

[junior94]

Originally Posted by DrewD55

Love Sam Waterston's work (Jack McCoy, drunker and shoutier than ever, which for some strange reason, is awesome in my book), as well as a few others, but if I can see the cracks this early on (too much Sorkin over the years; his patterns tend not to change too much), I don't see this being terribly good 4-5 episodes down the road.

totally cracked me up getting to see Waterston yell out shit and fucking in this

[Beebz]

Precipitous dropoff. The email screwup was telegraphed from space.

[water_into_wine]

Really didn't think it was that bad.

[smokew11]

i thought it held up. sure the email thing was obvious, but every show has sets and spikes like that one. the interviews were predictably awful and everything about it worked for the show, i think that 10 minutes or so was great. the show was very good imo

[Beebz]

It wasnt a bad episode, but to me it was a clear step below the fantastic pilot and the email sideplot was contrived to the point of embarrassment.

[smokew11]

Originally Posted by Beebz

It wasnt a bad episode, but to me it was a clear step below the fantastic pilot and the email sideplot was contrived to the point of embarrassment.

like i said, a set and spike...like every other show in the history of the world

[gjdt2scf13]

I enjoyed the premiere, but I thought this episode was even better.

[coldengrey12]

Originally Posted by dre2142

tsk tsk tsk.....

A supercut of Aaron Sorkin recycled dialogue. Its not even that he does it...its the amount of times he has done it. (7 minutes worth!)

http://www.buzzfeed.com/bfeld/a-supe...orkin-dialogue

That video is awesome.

Just watched the pilot of this. It was good enough to make me want to check out the next episode.

I think Alison Pill is such a bad ass. I've only seen her in a few things (Milk, In Treatment), but she's nailed every one and she's good in this, too.

[rconverse]

I laughed a lot last night. Not sure if it was all intentional.

[dre2142]

The Allison Pill and Jim Harper one on one interactions were way too over the top/overacted. It was like an overacted high school play.

The entire email thing....wow. No need to dwell on that anymore. Its obvious.

Show is just way too cynical and contrived.

The on air scenes are the best part of this show. The other stuff is just filler at this point and way too "fake" to me. It seems more of a satirical spin on things than anything.

[junior94]

Originally Posted by coldengrey12

I think Alison Pill is such a bad ass. I've only seen her in a few things (Milk, In Treatment), but she's nailed every one and she's good in this, too.

I was quite surprised that was the same girl who was the drummer in Scott Pilgrim (plus that movie was the first thing I ever saw her in). She just looks so different in this show I think, she was unrecognizable. In SP her character was almost to the point of looking androgynous, whereas in this she's pretty cute.