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Old 06-09-2009, 10:42 AM   #19
Dodo36
 
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Re: Hypothetical Album Production Question...

Before I begin I do want to say that I think Cavallo did great work, I'd put it a tie for #2 with Crash behind BTCS as #1. He's a great producer and you can hear the care he gave to each song on the record, which is truly a testament to his ability. But I think he fell into the trap a lot of producers do, over-production. You can certainly hear the production values of his previous work even though the music is different. I think it worked well for how the album turned out, but the album could have had more "DMB" moments. The end of the record feels more like Dave's Some Devil than a DMB record. My record would have been DMB front to back.

The drum reverbs and such worked on some songs, but the drums sounded overcompressed throughout the record - it works with a lot of bands, I just don't feel it was appropriate for this band. At times it felt like the drums were disconnected, as if the kit had been sample replaced and not reconnected [sample replacing in a nutshell (for those that don't know) keeps the exact performance, but changes the sound heard - it's not what Batson did to Carter]. The bass, though present, rarely has any true character. The guitars and guitar-esque instruments, Cavallo nailed. The vocals, I feel like he nailed as well. The horns should've been arranged around LeRoi, instead of improvised as they seem to be.

I would have made it the combination record that the band needs right now: radio friendly and jam heavy. The band needs a radio friendly record to keep drawing in new crowds and to maintain a presence on store shelves/iTunes. They also need some songs with longer jams to validate the long time fans and give a glimmer of the stage show to the uninitiated. I think this record hits the radio-friendly crowd well, but it strays towards the generic Pop/Rock more than it should in the production values.

First, Boyd is somewhat invisible on this album as it was released. He was way more present on the "april sessions." He is usually buried beneath a string orchestra sound that feels more midi than live. If it was live, then they messed with it too much because it sounds like midi. There wasn't enough Boyd being Boyd.

And LeRoi isn't as all over the record as I had hoped. His influence is, that can be argued, but his horn could be more present, more obvious. Granted, we don't know what they had to work with and for those of you that have said why not pull some LeRoi sax from the unused Stand Up cuts - each producer and album has its own contract with the band/label/etc. They may not be able to use that stuff without giving credit to Batson. As a producer myself, I know you want as little reminder of another producer and his sessions as possible - not out of vanity, but you want to keep your session distinct in the mind of the artist. If the other sessions were laborious and troublesome, you don't want its poison infecting your sessions.

My biggest complaint with this record is that there's not a solely DMB song on here - just the 5 of them. There's some kind of piano synth, or Tim, or Rashawn + Jeff, or Danny ... I felt that a better tribute to Roi would have included the classic set-up: Acoustic gtr + Vox, Bass, Drums, Vln, Sax. That said, I would also have had a song or two be just Dave, Boyd, Stefan, and Carter. That's the remainder of the band as it has always been, and it should have been represented.

I also thought there was too much Banjo on this record. Danny is a great player, and I really like him on the songs he's on - but it's a lot. Banjo just isn't a sound you associate with the band, even though it fits well. Bela has been a friend of the band's stage show for over a decade and it's always a pleasure, the same with Danny - always a pleasure to hear. I'll get into specifics later.

Horns - I feel the additional horns could've been worked on more. Rashawn and Jeff should've been able to live with the songs for some time before they laid it down. They have great instincts, and are both amazing. But in several places it doesn't feel like there's a continuity to the horns within the song.

I feel the same about Tim. It might have been a direction thing, sometimes as a producer when you have an artist that is just amazing you don't feel that you have the right, for lack of a better word off the top of my mind, to give them direction. You can easily psyche yourself out when you're one on one with an amazing talent. It's even easier to psyche yourself out when they are soft spoken and have a humble aire about them. Here's a perfect example - Prince worked with Miles Davis before he got really sick. Prince didn't feel he should give Miles any direction, and thusly never used any of the recordings because they weren't what he was trying to achieve. What he didn't know was that Miles loved trying to work himself into other people's visions, and then once there surpassing them. Not that Miles was soft-spoken. I think maybe the same thing happened with Rob and Tim without it being realized. I don't feel Tim adds to this record over-all the way he did UTTAD, Crash, and BTCS.

Somebody else went track by track, I'll do the same but with more of a producer mind set. I'll use only the 18 tracks that have been released. Of course all notes regarding Roi would be contingent upon what he actually got laid down. Everything here is just based more on my preferences and tendencies as a producer, and as having been a diehard fan of the band since before UTTAD.
I won't do the "this song would never have been in my session" or "this song wouldn't have made my cut" thing, it sort of cheapens it.

Grux - The horn has a definite "Heartbeat" feel to it, I would've maybe pushed it more in that direction. I think the length was fine, but maybe a reprise of it at the end would have been enjoyable to work toward. This one would be completely contingent on what Leroi noodlings were around.

SMLAM - Here's one where Tim could've added a hell of a lot to - the verse riff specifically. A second guitar part on top of the low end riff would improve it drastically. The bridge would definitely have been different under my eye, maybe more of a breakdown than a bridge. The horns would have been arranged a little more to create a true chord structure along the lines of the horns in Too Much. I don't think they achieved as much of that EWF sound as they wanted to. This would have been one to truly feature the horns, with breaks for all 3 horns to solo - but keep the sectioned parts based extremely on Roi.

FTWII - I would have kept Roi ghostly in the background the way Rob did, I liked that, I just would have put it more noticeably throughout. I'm not a fan of that staccato straight eighths riff, I might have had the band work something else out on that. This would have been the Boyd being Boyd song, LIOG style. Roi would be the only horn here.

LITHOG - I'm not sure that I would have done anything differently here. I might not have had dave do the over-pronounced vocal take [i.e. the quick "right here" on the 2nd chorus]. I might have tried to get Fonzi to do a bit more of flowing melodic bassline.
That'd be it that I'd do different. Maybe I would have ended it with a Roi solo or held-out note. Rob did great with this one.

Why I Am - Another one that I would have Tim be directed to add a bit more to, his solo is only okay not transcendent the way we've all heard him be. I might have tried to get a more JTR style breakdown thrown in there somewhere. I would've let everybody shine on this one, for at least a bar or two. The outro would have been a jam. This would have been one of the longer jam songs.

Dive In - I would've kept this as just the four remaining guys, one of the few I would have kept Roi off of. Tim doesn't add to it, he's just kind of there. Anything he does here Dave could easily do as well. The strings would more feature Boyd then being a whole orchestra. I'd put Stefan on the Upright, bowed since slapped wouldn't fit this song. Piano, Upright, Violin, and Drums might have worked well for this one.

Spaceman - More horns. I might have gotten Boyd to find a plucked part or see if he would be willing to try a mandolin on this one. The violin would definitely be more present on the choruses. If Roi didn't get much on this one, I might have Jeff and Bela together since they know each others playing so well. If Roi did a lot on this one, I'd keep Jeff off of it and have Danny there. I really like his work on this one. Have Rashawn solely as a support for sections beneath Roi or Jeff.

Squirm - I feel like they were trying to hard to get a Beatles vibe to the orchestration, I don't know what I'd have done different. There are so many minor things I might have done differently, but they'd all be just to see how it would sound. Nothing sticks out in my head. We know this one was after Roi per a Dave interview. I'm not sure

Alligator Pie - Definitely could have had Boyd being Boyd here. Robert Randolph would've been a cool guest here too. This would've been THE ensemble jam song. Give everybody a shining moment. As usual, pending Roi's work, the horns would've been all over this. I might've geared more towards a New Orleans Jazz / zydeco influence versus the hoedown feel it has. Where the time cuts at the end for the lead out is where I would have had the increasingly speeding up section, and only there.

Seven - The piano would be out, and boyd strums would be in its wake. Horns would've been more present in the mix and have a more prevelant part in the ending. I can hear where horns should've been all over this. And the horns should've done the breakdown riff with the gtr at least once or twice to help build more intensity. I would have brought it back in for one more run through the riff to end, like the way they do The Stone live.

Time Bomb - I would've fleshed out the "explosion" more. It's in the chord structure - there's no urgency to the explosion. I would've let there be an uncomfortable space between the AM radio vocal run through the chorus lyrics and the return of the next verse. Add to the intensity. The end jam chord progression needs to be darker. A minor 3rd run on the gtr and bass w/ boyd playing a major 3rd over it would have given chills. Outside of Dave's voice, no other instrument is angry. It's like the instruments are just playfully walking through it.

Baby Blue - I'd have this be performed Christmas Song live style. Cymbals sparingly. Put Fonzi on an upright and have him sparingly as well. Boyd playing a light counterpoint to the melody. Just the four. No jam.

You And Me - I would've mixed it to fit the album more. It's a good song, but it sticks out like a sore thumb on the album. The string section sounds extremely fake as is. I'm not sure what to do with this one. I would've recorded horns to fill out the violin as a section rather than have that fake sounding string section.

#27 - I think this was nailed on the head. Horns might have been more throughout, but not only in a support capacity. The song itself needs something. It's sort of a plateau, it doesn't take the listener anywhere. It reminds me a lot of the Lillywhite sessions.

Beach Ball - plucked violin on the pre-chorus. The violin kind of lulls around, uninspired. I would have had an instrumental run through of the chorus to end on. I like the horns on the chorus. Perfect as just the original 5. I like the Rashawn bit at the end, but it has no coninuity with the rest of the song. To keep that I would have had Rashawn more present earlier in the song. Maybe doubling Dave's voice. I could easily take it either way.

Little Red Bird - Violin come in lightly on verse 2. Bass instead of piano for the walking riff. Muted click would be replaced with Carter somehow. I like the feel it has now, but it feels more Some Devil than DMB as it is now.

Write A Song - Just the 5 of them works beautifully. Tim doesn't add anything to the studio version that Dave can't do. Add more Roi on the Soprano Sax if there was more recorded.

Corn Bread - At least a verse would be just Dave's voice and Carter's drums. Danny's good, but he's to all over this one doing just sort of generic banjo stuff. He can do so much more. From Danny's solo to the end I don't know how much I would actually change. It's just one of those songs that there aren't too many different ways that actually work for the mix. I'd just have Roi and Rashawn as the horns, though.


I say this all purely from being a producer myself. Most people don't truly understand what a producer does/is supposed to do. A producer is supposed to draw out the performance from the artist and maybe help them fix what doesn't work. A producer has to often play psychologist, mediator, and music director. Just like a movie needs a director, an album needs a producer. To varying degrees with different acts, but needed nonetheless. But too often a producer exerts too much of themselves into a project, ie Glenn Ballard and Mark Batson. They are both great producers in their own right, but not for the DMB. I think Roger Waters, Peter Gabriel, or producers like George Massenburg (Little Feat, Lyle Lovett, Toto), Nile Rodgers (Chic, David Bowie, INXS), Keith Olsen (Grateful Dead, Fleetwood Mac), or Ed Cherney (G'NR '88-'93, Sammy Hagar) would be good DMB producers if Rob doesn't return for the next. But I hope he does. I was skeptical of Cavallo at first, but he did a damn good job.
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