Little League World Series

[spoot388]

i feel like there should be some other breaking pitch that is less harmful to their arms that they can be throwing. maybe like a cutter or something? i remember being in little league and throwing junk all day. hardly anything went straight and some things i didn't even know what i was throwing. we didn't have signs. i'd just try a grip and see what happened. no clue how the catchers caught anything but i never had arm/elbow pain.

[cry_minarets458]

Im indifferent toward them throwing curveballs. This pitchers aren't going pro, so let them hang it all on the table.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by cry_minarets458

Im indifferent toward them throwing curveballs. This pitchers aren't going pro, so let them hang it all on the table.

kids in HS are getting TJ surgery now. its not just about going pro. kids are playing travel ball 11 months out of the year and putting hundreds of innings on arms that still have A LOT of growth and development left to do. when a 17 year old needs TJ because he already burned out his arm, there is a major problem.

thats why the LLWS has he pitch count/mandatory rest days rule in place, because if they didn't, these coaches would be throwing the same 2 kids out there every other day until their arms fall off. the kids are too young to know any better. they trust the adults who are in charge, and they often care more about winning.

[rickyh24]

Sounds like a coaching issue and not a curve ball issue.

[Roose13]

I thought it was proven arm issues on kids less have to do with the curve and more with just flat out pitching too much. Between city, travel, AAU and HS baseball from the ages of 10-16, good pitchers are throwing like crazy these summers.

[rustysurf83]

Originally Posted by rickyh24

Sounds like a coaching issue and not a curve ball issue.

It's an adult issue. Coaches and parents that care far too much about winning 12 year old "championships" with little regard for actual development.

[rustysurf83]

Originally Posted by Roose13

I thought it was proven arm issues on kids less have to do with the curve and more with just flat out pitching too much. Between city, travel, AAU and HS baseball from the ages of 10-16, good pitchers are throwing like crazy these summers.

Proven to a point. Most research indicates that curveballs aren't bad if proper pitching technique is used. Problem being that most 11/12 year olds don't have great fundamental deliveries. Like I said, if James Andrews thinks it is a bad idea, wouldn't let my kid do it.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by rustysurf83

Proven to a point. Most research indicates that curveballs aren't bad if proper pitching technique is used. Problem being that most 11/12 year olds don't have great fundamental deliveries. Like I said, if James Andrews thinks it is a bad idea, wouldn't let my kid do it.

this and also over-use of curveballs by kids with poor fundamentals. curves shouldn't be the #2 pitch in little league or really any league under college. it should be an occasional pitch thrown to fool a hitter who is not expecting it. kids should be throwing 4 seam fastballs, change ups, and learn how to make a 2 seam move. they won't need a curve much if they get those 3 down.

when i was in little league, i used to throw this 2 seam/slurve (essentially it was a backwards slider) that would dive down and in on a righty (i throw righty) and kids would swing over the top of it. it was thrown like a fastball so there was no strain on my arm. i threw tons of junk, but hardly ever threw a curve.

[cry_minarets458]

Spoot goes from curveballs outright hurting kids' arms and no idea what he's throwing to "overuse of curvesballs," poor mechanics, and suddenly remembers he threw a "2 seam/slurve" in addition to nothing but outright junk.

?

[Timebomb07]

A ton of kids threw 'sluves' in LL growing up. Though, we all considered them a hybrid between a 'slider' and 'curve' in which the pitcher gripped as if throwing a slider letting the rotation of the ball make it slide away from righties. Never heard of them moving into righties.

I developed a knuckle ball in LL instead of throwing sluves. Used that and a fastball until I was 14 and then begin to develop a curve and slider. All and all, worked out great as I then had 5 go-to pitches to use in my highschool and college days.

[spoot388]

Originally Posted by Timebomb07

A ton of kids threw 'sluves' in LL growing up. Though, we all considered them a hybrid between a 'slider' and 'curve' in which the pitcher gripped as if throwing a slider letting the rotation of the ball make it slide away from righties. Never heard of them moving into righties.

I developed a knuckle ball in LL instead of throwing sluves. Used that and a fastball until I was 14 and then begin to develop a curve and slider. All and all, worked out great as I then had 5 go-to pitches to use in my highschool and college days.

grip a ball like you're throwing a slider, then rotate the ball a quarter turn left or right so the slider grip is on the "wrong side" of the seam. instead of snapping your wrist like a slider, let the ball roll off your fingers like a fastball. instead of tumbling, it has backspin. as a right handed pitcher, it would cut down and in on a right handed batter. at least it did for me back then. no idea if its something anybody actually throws or what it would be called. it was just one of those "i wonder what would happen if i hold it like this?" situations because thats what you do when you're 11.


as for your knuckler, how much did it move? everyone always screwed around with trying to throw them but no one ever could. i figured the mound would be too short of a distance for it to really move like it does in the majors.

[Timebomb07]

Originally Posted by spoot388

grip a ball like you're throwing a slider, then rotate the ball a quarter turn left or right so the slider grip is on the "wrong side" of the seam. instead of snapping your wrist like a slider, let the ball roll off your fingers like a fastball. instead of tumbling, it has backspin. as a right handed pitcher, it would cut down and in on a right handed batter. at least it did for me back then. no idea if its something anybody actually throws or what it would be called. it was just one of those "i wonder what would happen if i hold it like this?" situations because thats what you do when you're 11.


as for your knuckler, how much did it move? everyone always screwed around with trying to throw them but no one ever could. i figured the mound would be too short of a distance for it to really move like it does in the majors.

To the bolded - totally get all of that. I guess I didn't see kids messing around that much with their grip, almost like a wiffle ball. If anything, it was developing a circle change, which has a similar rotation.

My knuckle definitely had more movement as I got older (more room to work with, better overall grip), but it could move pretty good in LL as well - enough where my catchers would miss catching it every so often. It was a tough pitch to control, obviously, but it worked well to simply throw off hitters because no one else threw one.

[recentlyJTR41]

It's an arm care issue. Coaches/parents/players aren't doing enough research on the issue. If you ever read into it you'll see how revolutionary the band movement is. Some travel organizations don't even warm up by throwing anymore. It's all band work.

[Timebomb07]

I do agree band work is awesome. I always thought it was pretty beneficial. Your saying it replaces position players throwing, right? You can't not throw before hitting the mound.

[TypicalBilly14]

Japan with a no-hitter vs. Cuba and only 1 combined hit in the game, wow.

Go Rhode Island!!!!

[TypicalBilly14]

https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/s...ostcount=35128

[TwoStep2888]

this was a fun LLWS

[scrock25]

I was looking for this fucking thread earlier when I posted in the MLB thread, Christ

[UNLTrpt]

Originally Posted by TypicalBilly14

https://www.antsmarching.org/forum/s...ostcount=35128

thats me!!!