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Old 10-16-2012, 03:35 PM   #91
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Re: The Apple Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by DIDriveOut2SPAC View Post
optical drives are becoming archaic in laptops when cloud based services are being implemented across all platforms.

I havent used my macbooks drive since 2010 I think.
this.

even usb thumb drives are obsolete.
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  • Old 10-16-2012, 04:24 PM   #92
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    Re: The Apple Thread

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    Originally Posted by justink View Post
    i'm a mac



    the reason the air is so thin and light is because there is no optical drive.

    think of it this way... you could build a smaller garage if you didn't have to house an RV in it.

    optical drives are nearly obsolete, and if you do need one, you can use an old computer to transfer the files or a cheap external. apple is just doing away with them altogether.
    Yes, I understand that...my confusion is over how people feel that shedding half an inch and a couple pounds is worth it.

    My buddy never/rarely uses his the trunk of his car. Would it make sense to design a car with no trunk simply because it's smaller and lighter? No. It's there for when he needs it.

    People are so obsessed with making things "more portable" that they sacrifice on the overall product and spend more for it. Seems stupid to me.

    I don't know, I'd rather have a fast laptop with a nice i7, 8 GB RAM, nice sized SSD, and a BD drive for my HD screen that weighs a couple extra pounds but costs $700 less.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 04:30 PM   #93
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    I have no apple products and probably won't ever purchase one. They do nothing for me.

    /coolstoryhansel
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    Old 10-16-2012, 04:32 PM   #94
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lockman21 View Post
    Yes, I understand that...my confusion is over how people feel that shedding half an inch and a couple pounds is worth it.

    My buddy never/rarely uses his the trunk of his car. Would it make sense to design a car with no trunk simply because it's smaller and lighter? No. It's there for when he needs it.

    People are so obsessed with making things "more portable" that they sacrifice on the overall product and spend more for it. Seems stupid to me.

    I don't know, I'd rather have a fast laptop with a nice i7, 8 GB RAM, nice sized SSD, and a BD drive for my HD screen that weighs a couple extra pounds but costs $700 less.

    http://media.treehugger.com/assets/i...-car-image.jpg
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    Old 10-16-2012, 04:37 PM   #95
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    Re: The Apple Thread

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    You made my point, thank you.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 04:38 PM   #96
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Apple essentially controls the music world, and they are in the process of controlling movies/tv. With the Mac App Store they're going after software as well. making a disc drive still allows the consumer to choose which outlet they get their media from.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 04:43 PM   #97
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lockman21 View Post
    You made my point, thank you.
    well... to be fair, who needs a trunk in a car when you can download your luggage, spare tire, and groceries from the cloud?
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    Old 10-16-2012, 05:30 PM   #98
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Apple has traditionally made these moves into future technology and dropped aging technology before the other companies have. For example when the iMac was introduced in the late 90's it was the first desktop to drop the floppy disk drive. People freaked out, but do we care at all now? Soon after every other company followed suit. So while it might seem shell-shocking for someone who uses their optical drive a lot now, in a few years it'll seem ridiculous that we're even having this convo about dropping the disc drive.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 05:32 PM   #99
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iMAC386 View Post
    Apple has traditionally made these moves into future technology and dropped aging technology before the other companies have. For example when the iMac was introduced in the late 90's it was the first desktop to drop the floppy disk drive. People freaked out, but do we care at all now? Soon after every other company followed suit. So while it might seem shell-shocking for someone who uses their optical drive a lot now, in a few years it'll seem ridiculous that we're even having this convo about dropping the disc drive.
    the only thing i use my optical drive for is to occasionally rip a cd... which i can still use either of my two old MacBooks if needed.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 05:48 PM   #100
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    Re: The Apple Thread

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    Originally Posted by daveshookme View Post
    Yeah, this. I do use Word and excel pretty regularly on both platforms and have never once ran into an issue. Not saying it's you, maybe its the email client/mem stick or something, or perhaps the mac itself is corrupted, but it's not Apple's fault.
    Then you don't have enough experience or the files aren't complicated enough for it to matter. It's happened every few days for years working with hundreds of people in my enterprise.

    It's cool that it's never happened to you, but trust me; it happens all the time, every day in real world situations that should be no problem. There is a problem between file formats between the suites for years. I agree it's not all Apple's fault, or all MS's fault or all the user's fault. Different things go wrong in different situations and a lot of times, a careful and informed user can get around the most common issues (complex cross-linked spreadsheet sets come to mind).

    But actually doing serious WORK with complex cross platform files blows. It's a poor experience. This is coming from someone that spends their own money on Apple hardware and works with Unix and Windows from work because our IT refuses to support an "Apple Sycophant" such as myself (their words) even to the point of not letting me dual boot my MBPs and use the VPNs.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 06:12 PM   #101
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justink View Post
    well... to be fair, who needs a trunk in a car when you can download your luggage, spare tire, and groceries from the cloud?
    This is probably your best post ever.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 06:16 PM   #102
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lockman21 View Post
    Yes, I understand that...my confusion is over how people feel that shedding half an inch and a couple pounds is worth it.

    My buddy never/rarely uses his the trunk of his car. Would it make sense to design a car with no trunk simply because it's smaller and lighter? No. It's there for when he needs it.

    People are so obsessed with making things "more portable" that they sacrifice on the overall product and spend more for it. Seems stupid to me.

    I don't know, I'd rather have a fast laptop with a nice i7, 8 GB RAM, nice sized SSD, and a BD drive for my HD screen that weighs a couple extra pounds but costs $700 less.
    Here's a different perspective. I just went in and weighed my work bag on the bathroom scale; 27lbs with an iPad as my connectivity device. That's zero books, no wallet, keys, phone or whatever other errata I might have in my pockets. I carry that pretty much every day from room to room based on what meetings or groups I'm working with that day. Now, this isn't like a book bag at school because it doesn't end in 4, 6 or 8 years (unless you're a teacher). This is every day and it was much worse when I carried IBM and Dell laptops everywhere; much worse.

    Paper is freaking heavy and I can't afford (takes too long) to go back and forth to my car between meetings to change out folders and paperwork. Unfortunately the people that I sit down with are too busy to give me 15 minutes to run back and forth across a hospital or medical complex campus for that. Since paper isn't getting any lighter... go go lighter/smaller electronics. Things like tablets allow me to pull up thousands of pages of research abstracts or access my hundreds of thousands of records of data without carry THAT paper around too during these meetings. It really blows when I'm expected to project that data in a room without built in projection.

    I'll trade ounces, let alone pounds. I'm going to be first in line for an iPad mini as well (as long as there's a cell option which looks to be the case thank god) because the full size iPad is a COMPLETE waste of weight and space to me. I'll be trading my current iPad 3 in on one barring something really strange about them.

    This is the same reason that frequent flyers (hello again) will spend twice or three times as much to get a much lighter carry on or checked bag. They can pack it heavier and when you have to lug it around a couple dozen times a year, it does actually matter. Same for backpacks, sleeping bags etc. Smaller and lighter matters to a fair enough amount of people that there's a market for it; otherwise there wouldn't be any smaller/lighter products. I would hope that's really obvious.
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    Last edited by diableri; 10-16-2012 at 06:20 PM.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 06:29 PM   #103
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by diableri View Post
    Then you don't have enough experience or the files aren't complicated enough for it to matter. It's happened every few days for years working with hundreds of people in my enterprise.

    It's cool that it's never happened to you, but trust me; it happens all the time, every day in real world situations that should be no problem. There is a problem between file formats between the suites for years. I agree it's not all Apple's fault, or all MS's fault or all the user's fault. Different things go wrong in different situations and a lot of times, a careful and informed user can get around the most common issues (complex cross-linked spreadsheet sets come to mind).

    But actually doing serious WORK with complex cross platform files blows. It's a poor experience. This is coming from someone that spends their own money on Apple hardware and works with Unix and Windows from work because our IT refuses to support an "Apple Sycophant" such as myself (their words) even to the point of not letting me dual boot my MBPs and use the VPNs.

    using the extension .docx and .xmlx has worked for me 1000s of times without issue. We have a cloud based service now so no need to email files anymore.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 06:43 PM   #104
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DIDriveOut2SPAC View Post
    using the extension .docx and .xmlx has worked for me 1000s of times without issue. We have a cloud based service now so no need to email files anymore.
    /shrug

    I am personally aware of around about 70 pages of Word .docxs per patient, per cath lab, per day of which we do about 22 in one lab of which we have 4 in town and 21 in the system. We have 31 interventional cardiologists at my home site (single hospital) that interact with those documents and of those, I think about half are on macs of various versions/flavors. There is a call about a formatting/translation problem at least every other day (mobile app, OSX on a MacBook or desktops depending on the office) where one of the clerks needs to reopen the docx, save it as a pdf and resend it to them outside the automated set up. It would be fantastic if it was the same office/user/machine/lab/hemo unit all the time, no such luck.

    The system is set up by GE, Apple, Dell and Perot Systems (Unix->Windows->Oracle->MSOffice->OSXOffice. These issues are outside their willingness to fix at that rate of failure. That is one single file type from one single patient procedure in one instance that is an excellent example of a simple failure. There is absolutely nothing tricky about these documents either, straight up populated table saved word docxs.

    We can't do complex formatting of medical report forms between Word either without any automation. I could give you dozens of examples since I have to deal with it, every week. Don't even get me started on complex spreadsheets or presentations. Formatting is the least of the damage that is done.

    I guess what I'm saying is, 1000s is nothing. Try millions.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 09:35 PM   #105
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by diableri View Post
    /shrug

    I am personally aware of around about 70 pages of Word .docxs per patient, per cath lab, per day of which we do about 22 in one lab of which we have 4 in town and 21 in the system. We have 31 interventional cardiologists at my home site (single hospital) that interact with those documents and of those, I think about half are on macs of various versions/flavors. There is a call about a formatting/translation problem at least every other day (mobile app, OSX on a MacBook or desktops depending on the office) where one of the clerks needs to reopen the docx, save it as a pdf and resend it to them outside the automated set up. It would be fantastic if it was the same office/user/machine/lab/hemo unit all the time, no such luck.

    The system is set up by GE, Apple, Dell and Perot Systems (Unix->Windows->Oracle->MSOffice->OSXOffice. These issues are outside their willingness to fix at that rate of failure. That is one single file type from one single patient procedure in one instance that is an excellent example of a simple failure. There is absolutely nothing tricky about these documents either, straight up populated table saved word docxs.

    We can't do complex formatting of medical report forms between Word either without any automation. I could give you dozens of examples since I have to deal with it, every week. Don't even get me started on complex spreadsheets or presentations. Formatting is the least of the damage that is done.

    I guess what I'm saying is, 1000s is nothing. Try millions.
    Surely when you have a sample size of millions there's going to be some issues, especially when porting from platform to platform and back numerous times. But that's no reason to avoid one platform or another. If everything were on Macs (or pc's, or unix), I doubt you'd be having the issues (at least not at the numbers you claim), no?
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    Old 10-16-2012, 09:47 PM   #106
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DIDriveOut2SPAC View Post
    I own apple products because thats what my school used and i purchased through tuition, and I have an iphone form work, but can some one tell me why apple "owns so hard"?

    Japs have thought and implemented way better stuff so far then apple. I appreciate the design of my apple products, but they are nothing much and not at all revolutionary...
    were you at Guadalcanal or something?
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    Old 10-16-2012, 10:18 PM   #107
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by daveshookme View Post
    Surely when you have a sample size of millions there's going to be some issues, especially when porting from platform to platform and back numerous times. But that's no reason to avoid one platform or another. If everything were on Macs (or pc's, or unix), I doubt you'd be having the issues (at least not at the numbers you claim), no?
    That's my point exactly. The guy earlier in the thread was making a clear statement that there's a problem moving office documents back and forth across the the platforms. There was an assertion that was not the case when there clearly is and it doesn't take millions, it was just the easiest example I could come up with off the top of my head. Basically what you would find in any medium sized company in a first world setting not in an enclosed IT setting.

    I even stated clearly when serious work is being done, not term papers, party invitations, dissertations or family photos. That's why macs do not have the market share in the enterprise. Shit doesn't "just work". It never "just works" in any electronics of scale and heavy use and anyone preaching that it does with Macs or Apple products and doesn't with anything else is delusional. Macs are great for Some Stuff, Windows is great for Some Stuff and Some Stuff they both blow at.

    Here's a much smaller sample size for you. I am cursed to organize an annual CME event every year. Six speakers for the last 11 years (the 11th is this Saturday in fact). So that's 60 speakers. Every year at least one of them has a problem with their presentation (I'd say 75% of these guys use Macs). We wind up dumping it to a PC for editing because the AV company is PC based and it's their call. It hoses their formatting EVERY SINGLE TIME and the presentation needs to be rebuilt with their assets and text. I'm not talking fonts, I'm talking transitions, picture sizing/placement etc. I am positive of this because they always panic and I have to babysit them and assure them that the AV guy is great at this and he'll have it sorted in no time.

    I'll blame half of these on the users because... well trust me half of these are their fault. But the other half? But the other half are professional $10k an hour speakers that know exactly what they are doing with their hardware and software. Let's say it's only 25% of them. That's an atrocious failure rate on a small sample size. Yeah, there's audio/video, animated transitions and sometimes some linked data visualization etc so they are not simple but still...

    Out of curiosity, I just loaded up a very simple .pptx from an email and opened it in Keynote in on my iPad. There's nothing in this presentation but graphs and legends built in powerpoint a few months ago. They are overlapping and unreadable in Keynote. Now it's not Office on a Mac (cause it's on my iPad) so that gets a pass in my book, but honestly; how tough should that be to get right? I couldn't just open and present this in a meeting. I'd have to edit it or recreate it on the iPad or a Mac if I didn't want to go get a PC to drag somewhere.

    Anyway, thanks for the easy venting valve; I needed that. I just spent the last few days fighting some of these very same issues. I'd been trying to convince a high volume cards office to dump their macs to get rid of some of these problems and quit listening to a local sales guy preach about how they are easier to work with when they clearly cause them nothing but grief on daily basis (they have to dual boot half the office because the PACS software package they spent nearly a $mil on up front and $29k a year in service fees has no OSX client that's been promised for two years...). They thought they had to have macs to use their iPads for their charting.
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    Old 10-16-2012, 10:25 PM   #108
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    What I meant was one of the speakers every year has a problem with their presentation and it's almost always a mac user (not because it's a mac, because that fucker Murphy is in play and his law rules the world).
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    Old 10-23-2012, 10:21 AM   #109
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    So rumors for the new 13" are a go. Thinner, lighter (under 4lbs), retina display, USB 3, 2x Tbolts and HDMI plus an SD Card reader. Good stuff. If I needed a new notebook right now, this would be it.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:31 AM   #110
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    I like iPad mini. I've been wanting a smaller tablet.

    Crazy, I remember Steve Jobs always talking about how he didn't want to do an iPad mini then after he passes they're like, "iPad mini, bitches!"
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:38 AM   #111
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chadizzy1 View Post
    I like iPad mini. I've been wanting a smaller tablet.

    Crazy, I remember Steve Jobs always talking about how he didn't want to do an iPad mini then after he passes they're like, "iPad mini, bitches!"
    Yep, I'm trading my iPad 3 in for one ASAP.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:40 AM   #112
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Definitely interested in the iPad mini. I have an iPad 1. I need an upgrade.

    What's the pricing?
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:44 AM   #113
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Wi-Fi

    16GB $329
    32GB $429
    64GB $529

    Wi-Fi + Cellular

    16GB $459
    32GB $559
    64GB $659
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:45 AM   #114
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by neumdogg View Post
    Definitely interested in the iPad mini. I have an iPad 1. I need an upgrade.

    What's the pricing?
    Wi-Fi
    16GB
    $329
    32GB
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    64GB
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    Wi-Fi + Cellular
    16GB
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:46 AM   #115
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Think the mini is dumb, hate smaller tablets.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:46 AM   #116
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by diableri View Post
    Yep, I'm trading my iPad 3 in for one ASAP.
    Had a very short life span. iPad 2 stays, iPad 3 dropped, iPad 4 released. Sorry for iPad 3 owners. I knew there was a reason I skipped that one, glad I did now.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:48 AM   #117
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justink View Post
    the only thing i use my optical drive for is to occasionally rip a cd... which i can still use either of my two old MacBooks if needed.
    That was the only reason I was worried about ditching optical, but honestly, 99% of music now probably comes with free digital downloads, and I don't even buy CDs anymore, I use iTunes Store. CDs take up too much space.

    But honestly, my early 2012 pro has an optical and I don't even use it. Next time I purchase new laptop, probably 2013 I'm going without optical.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 11:52 AM   #118
    diableri
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chadizzy1 View Post
    Had a very short life span. iPad 2 stays, iPad 3 dropped, iPad 4 released. Sorry for iPad 3 owners. I knew there was a reason I skipped that one, glad I did now.
    It was OK for me, when I get rid of mine I will have basically rented it for about $150 which is fine with me. It allowed me to stop carrying my notebook which was worth it and I didn't have a tablet at the time. It was a wash and had to have iOS.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 12:13 PM   #119
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by diableri View Post
    So rumors for the new 13" are a go. Thinner, lighter (under 4lbs), retina display, USB 3, 2x Tbolts and HDMI plus an SD Card reader. Good stuff. If I needed a new notebook right now, this would be it.
    13" is just way too tiny for me. i need 17".... really hope they bring them back.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by LadyMadonna68 View Post
    Wi-Fi

    16GB $329
    32GB $429
    64GB $529

    Wi-Fi + Cellular

    16GB $459
    32GB $559
    64GB $659
    way too expensive imho. i just don't see the point of a mini yet, but i'm sure they'll fly off the shelves.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chadizzy1 View Post
    That was the only reason I was worried about ditching optical, but honestly, 99% of music now probably comes with free digital downloads, and I don't even buy CDs anymore, I use iTunes Store. CDs take up too much space.

    But honestly, my early 2012 pro has an optical and I don't even use it. Next time I purchase new laptop, probably 2013 I'm going without optical.
    most definitely.
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    Old 10-23-2012, 12:18 PM   #120
    diableri
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    Re: The Apple Thread

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justink View Post
    13" is just way too tiny for me. i need 17".... really hope they bring them back.
    There's just no way I'm carrying a 17" around with me everywhere. If I need a screen that size, I'm using a 30" or multiple monitors on a desktop. The 11" air would be fine for me if it wasn't so off balance when typing on uneven surfaces. But I get it for people that don't have to carry their laptops all over the place or use them for their main computers.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by justink View Post
    way too expensive imho. i just don't see the point of a mini yet, but i'm sure they'll fly off the shelves.
    Full size tablets are just totally wasted size and weight for me or anyone else like me, just like the larger laptops. I have no need for larger screens and I can't easily go through large documents on a phone. 7 inch size tablets are just about perfect size for that kind of thing.
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    Last edited by diableri; 10-23-2012 at 12:21 PM.
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