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Old 11-28-2017, 09:47 AM   #2911
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Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

Quote:
Originally Posted by snow1868 View Post
Yeah, the digital download blows the vinyl rip sound quality out of the water. This is such a great release.
kept telling people this but they kept claiming the vinyl rip was good, but when you listen to this, the vinyl rip sucks.
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  • Old 11-28-2017, 10:03 AM   #2912
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I'm sorry if it's been discussed, but what's up with the relative slamming, dynamics-wise?

    I love the thing either way and I never really could tell a huge difference anyway, but looking at the dynamic range database entry for the 24/96 flac, there's a whole lot of red on that page:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/138376
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    Old 11-28-2017, 11:09 AM   #2913
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by YouNeverKnow25 View Post
    I'm sorry if it's been discussed, but what's up with the relative slamming, dynamics-wise?

    I love the thing either way and I never really could tell a huge difference anyway, but looking at the dynamic range database entry for the 24/96 flac, there's a whole lot of red on that page:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/138376
    If you take a look at all the tracks, only three hit "7", nothing less than a "7". DR8 starts the "transition" scores and is the number that Ian Shepherd, mastering engineer and founder of Dynamic Range Day, considers the minimal score for eligibility into the annual awards - Babel I believe won the award several years ago and was a DR8 album.

    Ideally the 24-bit files would have more dynamics in them and have more headroom, consider the SACD mastering of Rage Against the Machine's debut album by Steve Hoffman:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/115621

    But now look at the 20th anniversary mastering compared to the DMB 25:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/56873

    All tracks have clipping, of the actual album tracks only a single one hits as high as 7 and a couple of DR4s in there.

    Albums like Californication which are mostly DR4s and 5s (http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/83434) are noticeable pretty immediately and sound not very good. When you get into the transitional phase you're hitting the middle ground, DR7~9 without any clipping should sound noticeably better than DR3-5 regardless of clipping. Crash scores a DR8 but has loads of clipping, so when you go from the vinyl to the CD and crank it you'll notice that it sounds pretty cold and harsh, lower volumes not so much.

    For me it's disappointing that it isn't a fully dynamic mastering (like some of the DMBLive releases have been and most recently the WH10v3), but it's definitely come a long way from the original digital masterings of Live Trax 1-5 and has hit the "compromise" point of not so quiet that people complain they can't turn it up loud enough, and not slammed so that people complain it's a victim of the loudness wars.

    That's my $0.02 anyway.

    It does cost more to do two masterings, but I would love to see the modern LTs with 24-bit offerings be mastered without any dynamic range compression and then release the 16-bit options with a volume level more similar to what people are used to. Until then I consider what we're getting "acceptable".
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    Old 11-29-2017, 06:02 AM   #2914
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dobyblue View Post
    If you take a look at all the tracks, only three hit "7", nothing less than a "7". DR8 starts the "transition" scores and is the number that Ian Shepherd, mastering engineer and founder of Dynamic Range Day, considers the minimal score for eligibility into the annual awards - Babel I believe won the award several years ago and was a DR8 album.

    Ideally the 24-bit files would have more dynamics in them and have more headroom, consider the SACD mastering of Rage Against the Machine's debut album by Steve Hoffman:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/115621

    But now look at the 20th anniversary mastering compared to the DMB 25:

    http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/56873

    All tracks have clipping, of the actual album tracks only a single one hits as high as 7 and a couple of DR4s in there.

    Albums like Californication which are mostly DR4s and 5s (http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/83434) are noticeable pretty immediately and sound not very good. When you get into the transitional phase you're hitting the middle ground, DR7~9 without any clipping should sound noticeably better than DR3-5 regardless of clipping. Crash scores a DR8 but has loads of clipping, so when you go from the vinyl to the CD and crank it you'll notice that it sounds pretty cold and harsh, lower volumes not so much.

    For me it's disappointing that it isn't a fully dynamic mastering (like some of the DMBLive releases have been and most recently the WH10v3), but it's definitely come a long way from the original digital masterings of Live Trax 1-5 and has hit the "compromise" point of not so quiet that people complain they can't turn it up loud enough, and not slammed so that people complain it's a victim of the loudness wars.

    That's my $0.02 anyway.

    It does cost more to do two masterings, but I would love to see the modern LTs with 24-bit offerings be mastered without any dynamic range compression and then release the 16-bit options with a volume level more similar to what people are used to. Until then I consider what we're getting "acceptable".
    I honestly understand nothing here, but I believe everything you just said, and if anyone disagrees, I will stand with you in battle.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 06:26 AM   #2915
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I have a once-played Live 25 set for sale if anyone needs one. $200 shipped, this is essentially face when shipping is factored, pm me or email chrisjuniper@gmail.com
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    Old 12-01-2017, 08:56 AM   #2916
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Finally bought the FLACs, can’t wait to listen to this.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 12:36 PM   #2917
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Been listening to this in bits and pieces. For me it's difficult to listen to live DMB when it's not a cohesive show for some reason. I love the flow of a live show, even if it's broken up over 5 trips to work and back. Kind of like following a story.

    This release has some great versions, but Shotgun is not one of them. I don't know if a dart was thrown at board to pick this version, or if Jake just loves it or what. This version sucks.

    Doobie thing is cool. I'm glad to finally hear a quality version of this with no tape hiss.

    JTR is always good.

    Break For It will always be a favorite "unreleased" tune, and am glad to have a version of it now, but the Gorge 2010 blows this one away.

    Don't get having DDTW on here, but not some other staples like Ants, Recently, WWYS. What makes this particular version so special of all the other dozens we have released.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 12:38 PM   #2918
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I'll back you up is the best version ever.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 12:41 PM   #2919
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mexicaliblues View Post
    Break For It will always be a favorite "unreleased" tune, and am glad to have a version of it now, but the Gorge 2010 blows this one away.
    Agreed. Nice to have a good copy of any version, but the Gorge version is much much better.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 12:44 PM   #2920
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Route_2 View Post
    Agreed. Nice to have a good copy of any version, but the Gorge version is much much better.
    Ya! Again, don't know how these versions were picked. Or how many opinions were involved in releasing them. Someone clearly loved the ones released, so to each their own I guess.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 07:47 PM   #2921
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    This Stone is hauntingly beautiful, my lord. Like what Orpheus played to make his way through and past the entire defenses of the underworld to win back his Eurydice beautiful.
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    Old 12-01-2017, 09:36 PM   #2922
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mexicaliblues View Post
    I'll back you up is the best version ever.
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    Old 12-02-2017, 05:27 AM   #2923
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I love the combo of "A Dream So Real" and "Busted Stuff" back to back. Wasn't expecting to revisit those particular songs as much as I have been, but they're both beautiful and perfectly executed versions.

    And although the whole thing is pretty stellar, my favorites from the rest of the collection are JTR, You Never Know, Pig, Stone, Lover Lay Down, Snow Outside, Warehouse, 34, I'll Back You Up, Bartender, Falling Off The Roof (grew on me), Break For It, and Rhyme & Reason.
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    Old 12-02-2017, 08:40 AM   #2924
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by djamieb View Post
    I love the combo of "A Dream So Real" and "Busted Stuff" back to back. Wasn't expecting to revisit those particular songs as much as I have been, but they're both beautiful and perfectly executed versions.

    And although the whole thing is pretty stellar, my favorites from the rest of the collection are JTR, You Never Know, Pig, Stone, Lover Lay Down, Snow Outside, Warehouse, 34, I'll Back You Up, Bartender, Falling Off The Roof (grew on me), Break For It, and Rhyme & Reason.
    So you're saying you enjoy the entire release.
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    Old 12-02-2017, 01:29 PM   #2925
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by djamieb View Post
    I love the combo of "A Dream So Real" and "Busted Stuff" back to back. Wasn't expecting to revisit those particular songs as much as I have been, but they're both beautiful and perfectly executed versions.

    And although the whole thing is pretty stellar, my favorites from the rest of the collection are JTR, You Never Know, Pig, Stone, Lover Lay Down, Snow Outside, Warehouse, 34, I'll Back You Up, Bartender, Falling Off The Roof (grew on me), Break For It, and Rhyme & Reason.
    Rhyme & Reason for me is a little too sloppy for me to enjoy it. Strange pick to be included on this release, IMO.
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    Old 12-03-2017, 05:25 PM   #2926
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I'm selling a sealed copy if anyone is interested...
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    Old 12-05-2017, 06:36 AM   #2927
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by snow1868 View Post
    So you're saying you enjoy the entire release.
    Hahaha! Indeed.

    Just started listing my personal highlights as I looked through the tracklist, and it would seem I picked all but 3 or 4 songs.

    Good callout.
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    Old 12-05-2017, 06:56 AM   #2928
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by WidespreadMule3 View Post
    Between this release and Phish - A Live One, I can't think of more perfect albums in my possession. Desert island type stuff.
    Fucking Legit!
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    Old 12-05-2017, 01:02 PM   #2929
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    fell into another extra copy for a stupid good price, so I have another once used set for $125 if anyone here is on the fence about getting a copy, I promise you won't get one cheaper than this. pm or email me chrisjuniper@gmail.com
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    Old 12-07-2017, 03:45 PM   #2930
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Any vinyl copies floating around?
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    Old 12-07-2017, 03:53 PM   #2931
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by chrisjuniper View Post
    fell into another extra copy for a stupid good price, so I have another once used set for $125 if anyone here is on the fence about getting a copy, I promise you won't get one cheaper than this. pm or email me chrisjuniper@gmail.com
    emailed!
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    Old 12-29-2017, 06:58 AM   #2932
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Man, how great are these records...
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    Old 12-29-2017, 10:43 AM   #2933
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hilly View Post
    Man, how great are these records...
    Not sure, just over here enjoying my digital copy.
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    Old 12-29-2017, 04:20 PM   #2934
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hilly View Post
    Man, how great are these records...
    I wish they’d move the studio album pressings to Pallas, such a great pressing house.
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    Old 12-29-2017, 05:55 PM   #2935
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dobyblue View Post
    I wish they’d move the studio album pressings to Pallas, such a great pressing house.
    Do we know what the difference in DR is between the vinyl and the download of this? (Or if there is one?) DR Database has an entry for the download that puts it at DR9.

    The vinyl sounds to my ears like it's certainly got a wider range than that, but who knows?
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    Old 12-29-2017, 08:33 PM   #2936
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AlexK79 View Post
    Do we know what the difference in DR is between the vinyl and the download of this? (Or if there is one?) DR Database has an entry for the download that puts it at DR9.

    The vinyl sounds to my ears like it's certainly got a wider range than that, but who knows?
    It's impossible to know what the DR for the vinyl is without someone comparing who actually has the cutting master. The fact that the download has all 10 side breaks leads me to believe they're identical, why create different masterings and not remove all the side breaks?
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    Old 12-29-2017, 10:26 PM   #2937
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    I’d pay what I paid for DMB Live 25 for a vinyl set of Benaroya Hall
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    Old 12-29-2017, 10:59 PM   #2938
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    DMB Live 25 is a quintessential addition to have in any DMB fan’s live collection to go along with RR95, LS, LiC, CP, etc.
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    Old 12-30-2017, 05:17 AM   #2939
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by dobyblue View Post
    I wish they’d move the studio album pressings to Pallas, such a great pressing house.
    I agree. Never had a single issue with a Pallas pressed record of mine. MPO has been alright, but I've been seeing a lot of non-fill issues lately. Wondering if they're just over capacity and it's causing some QC problems
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    Old 12-30-2017, 09:56 AM   #2940
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    Re: DMB Live 25 - 5LP Vinyl (180g)

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by snow1868 View Post
    Not sure, just over here enjoying my digital copy.
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